RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted May 16, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 16, 2019 As my current batch of coach painting continues apace, I have been giving some attention to the finishing touches. One of the key jobs that needs to be completed is adding roof boards to completed rakes of coaches. I am trying to work out which services should have them and which would not, fortunately I have photos of more than half the services I am modelling (even if I cant make out the wording). So there is a little guess work as to whether it should say PADDINGTON AND PLYMOUTH or PADDINGTON, EXETER AND PLYMOUTH. For the return working would a coach have its boards changed to PLYMOUTH, EXETER AND PADDINGTON or would a set of coaches which is working in both directions have the same boards? Speaking of the boards themselves, is there a consensus as to which is the best product? Does anyone produce the smaller version which was used on Hawksworth coaches, (I will be needing them for the Cornish Riviera Express) Finally, I think I am right in saying there is also an additional sliding panel that is added to the side of coaches in black, but I am not sure what it should say (or how it changes with different coaches in a rake). 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold gwrrob Posted May 16, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 16, 2019 I've used the weather proof versions of these products http://www.precisionlabels.com/sl3.html 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted May 16, 2019 Share Posted May 16, 2019 The Sankey Scenic ones look good. https://www.sankeyscenics.co.uk/pre-war-trains-oo-a-l/4577560470 Jason 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovex Posted May 16, 2019 Share Posted May 16, 2019 There were some articles in the last few editions of the GWR journal about the coach boards. I'll try and find a copy. I seem to recall the board's didn't change regardless of the direction. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted May 16, 2019 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted May 16, 2019 1 hour ago, rovex said: There were some articles in the last few editions of the GWR journal about the coach boards. I'll try and find a copy. I seem to recall the board's didn't change regardless of the direction. Thanks would be very interested to hear what it says. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovex Posted May 16, 2019 Share Posted May 16, 2019 It was editions 98, 100 & 102. The boards were bidirectional. So if a train started from Paddington. The board listed Paddington first whether the train was going to or from. So no change of boards when the train came back. 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted May 17, 2019 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted May 17, 2019 That’s great news, will save a lot of effort. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Harlequin Posted May 17, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 17, 2019 (edited) On 16/05/2019 at 17:58, Steamport Southport said: The Sankey Scenic ones look good. https://www.sankeyscenics.co.uk/pre-war-trains-oo-a-l/4577560470 Jason Edit: Allan from Sankey Scenics assures us (below) that his products are the correct 72mm wide. I believe the prototype boards were 18 feet long equating to 72mm in 4mm scale but some I have bought from another supplier are only 69mm long... This is not just an accuracy problem, it also means that they don't quite sit on the mountings that are moulded onto many RTR coach roofs. When I found this problem I started trying to make my own but I'm still experimenting with fonts, printer resolution and the best paper/card stock to use. E.g. Edited May 18, 2019 by Harlequin 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold john dew Posted May 17, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 17, 2019 Good point about the length. Have you decided on a font yet? Second question.......should they be black on white? I believe they were varnished which, in time,, tended to look pale cream/yellow. I had problems finding the best printing medium to avoid buckling Fascinating thread. Regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Harlequin Posted May 17, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 17, 2019 (edited) The closest font I found for the pre-war GWR boards is "Century". Unfortunately there are many sources for fonts of that name and I can't remember where I got my version from. (I might be able to find the site in my browser history later.) The example I showed above has had some typography applied to it: The characters and the spacing between them are compressed slightly (aspect ratio and tracking altered). This is exactly the sort of thing the original signwriters would have done to make the text fit to best advantage and be legible. (Also double-spaces between words.) For comparison here's "The Bristolian", where the characters and spacing have been stretched instead of compressed (same font): I hadn't really got as far as thinking about colour but maybe the best idea would be to print them black on white and then varnish/weather them down? (BTW: The Sankey ones are printed black on white.) Edited May 17, 2019 by Harlequin 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovex Posted May 17, 2019 Share Posted May 17, 2019 Again from the GWR journal article. Roof label boards were 17ft 10 3/4 inch long. To fit between brackets 18ft apart. The boards were 8 3/4 inch high. Boards on hawksworth coaches were shorter and fitted below the gutter. There were three styles of lettering. Style 1 is illustrated with a Cornish Riviera board. Fattish serifis my description. Style. Style 2 I would describe as a thinner version of 1 again serif. Style 3 is a thin sans serif style of lettering. No information is given in the article about colour except to refer to an article by the HMRS. Nor are any colour photos provided. But all three types appear to BE black on white. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Harlequin Posted May 18, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 18, 2019 (edited) Free Century font files can be downloaded from here: https://www.wfonts.com/font/century Note: Be very careful to only click the "Download font" buttons, not any of the "Start" or "Start Now" buttons. The later font style is alleged to be the GWR's own version of Gill Sans (Harris). Microsoft offer a free version of Gill Sans here: https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/p/gill-sans-nova/9pk93bg0z1jj?activetab=pivot%3Aoverviewtab Have a look at the wonderful photo in this thread: This is not quite right but something like this: @rovex Do the GWR Journal articles say what size the Hawksworth boards were? Edit: My estimate is that they were 15ft long. Edited May 18, 2019 by Harlequin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovex Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 (edited) Hi harlequin. Just checked the articles and no mention of the size of boards used on the hawksworth coaches. Just that they were shorter. Edited May 18, 2019 by rovex Added additional text 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sankey Scenics Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 16 hours ago, Harlequin said: Be slightly wary of these. I believe the prototype boards were 18 feet long equating to 72mm in 4mm scale but the Sankey ones are 69mm long - at least the ones I bought are... This is not just an accuracy problem, it also means that they don't quite sit on the mountings that are moulded onto many RTR coach roofs. When I found this problem I started trying to make my own but I'm still experimenting with fonts, printer resolution and the best paper/card stock to use. E.g. I am not quite sure what boards you have got but the ones that I produce are 72mm long (ie 18 feet in 4mm scales). Allan Sankey Scenics Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Harlequin Posted May 18, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 18, 2019 25 minutes ago, Sankey Scenics said: I am not quite sure what boards you have got but the ones that I produce are 72mm long (ie 18 feet in 4mm scales). Allan Sankey Scenics Hi Allan, I've just looked out a set from my spares box but I don't have the original packaging and there's no branding on it, other than "pack no 23". It's possible this could come from another manufacturer (and the boards are shorter than 72mm). I really apologise if I've got my wires crossed and incorrectly maligned your product. I will edit my post above. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sankey Scenics Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 Thank you for your edit, whilst it is easy to make assumptions, it is very clear from the coding that this wasn't one of my products. I spend a lot of time doing research to try and get things right unlike the ebayers, etc. who are not particularly bothered so long as they earn some tax free pocket money. On the subject of Hawksworth boards, I have been working on a range of these for both GWR / BR periods, again to the correct dimensions which are shorter and narrower. These will be released in the next few weeks. Thank you Allan 2 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Fatadder Posted May 18, 2019 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted May 18, 2019 Hi Allan, that’s great news, will be placing an order once they are available Would it be possible to do a pack for the 1947 Cornish Riviera which contained 4 Hawksworth and 5 standard roof boards (plus 2 Hawksworth and 1 standard in the Plymouth section) I like that they are including the coach seating numbers. (Something I hadn’t realised was a thing) can anyone advise, did all trains have these number boards fitted or just those main trains that also would have roof boards. (I assume a definite no for local M Sets etc) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sankey Scenics Posted May 18, 2019 Share Posted May 18, 2019 2 hours ago, The Fatadder said: Hi Allan, that’s great news, will be placing an order once they are available Would it be possible to do a pack for the 1947 Cornish Riviera which contained 4 Hawksworth and 5 standard roof boards (plus 2 Hawksworth and 1 standard in the Plymouth section) I like that they are including the coach seating numbers. (Something I hadn’t realised was a thing) can anyone advise, did all trains have these number boards fitted or just those main trains that also would have roof boards. (I assume a definite no for local M Sets etc) Hi That's not a problem. They can be ordered now - just drop me and email at sankeyscenics@live.co.uk with the details and I can sort this out for you (mixed pack of 18 feet boards and Hawksworth boards). Just let me have the precise details and then I would get back to you with a proof. I include coach seating numbers in the GWR packs although these were not always used and certainly only on express services (to my knowledge). Hope this helps. Allan https://www.sankeyscenics.co.uk/4mm-coach-dest-gwr-stock/4592065218 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
GWRMember Posted May 19, 2019 Share Posted May 19, 2019 . Roof Label Boards. What you are asking for is in the 18'0" boards is in the Great Western Study Group Pannier No.8 Winter 1996 publication. Back numbers can be had from The Publications officer E Mail stephenmanchip@googlemail.com Regards Ken Membership Secretary GWSG Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sankey Scenics Posted May 29, 2019 Share Posted May 29, 2019 Coach destination boards for Hawkworth stock - just been released for both GWR period and British Railway (Western Region). To view visit www.sankeyscenics.co.uk or click the link below: https://www.sankeyscenics.co.uk/4mm-coach-dest-hawksworth/4594625495 Allan Sankey Scenics 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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