Rugby Union

[rockershovel]

Well, here’s a thing...

 

 

 

..... this seems to mean that England are favourites to win the Championship! I wouldn’t put money on France getting the bonus point against Ireland. However I WOULD fancy Ireland for the bonus point against Italy, if, as and when the game is played.... 

 

So, France v Ireland could well decide second place (given that it’s hard to fancy Scotland in Cardiff, which could well decide third place). 

 

Italy might well find themselves playing two consecutive games against sides with everything to play for, both wanting the bonus win. England don’t actually need to concern themselves with the Italian score, provided that THEY score one more, but there’s the matter of never having conceded a single point to Italy in the 6N to bear in mind...

 

Italy can also expect an uncomfortable interview with CVC, who seem to have dazzled the “blazerati” with money. The temptation to replace these no-hopers with a rotating cast of, well, OTHER no-hopers must be obvious... if I were the Italian coach, I’d be making sure my LinkedIn page was up to date...

 

[Dave47549]

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Edited October 4, 2021 by Dave47549
Removed pointless guff

[rockershovel]

30 minutes ago, Dave47549 said:

 

Just abandon* the Italy v. England match (due to timescale circumstances in holding the original fixture) & award 2 points. Eddie should be happy with that, he was o.k. the last time it happened... 

 

* also Ireland v. Italy

 

Completely different situation

* the tournament rules specifically provided for that

* France and England were both qualifying anyway

* France would beat themselves, by playing half the game with 14 men after a blatant foul

 

 

[62613]

19 hours ago, rockershovel said:

Reverting to the 6N, I see that France STILL haven’t quite worked out that committing obvious, blatant fouls, right in front of the ref, halfway through the game, probably isn’t the way forward. 

 

 

The France of old, there; complete lack of discipline. They were giving away penalties in the first half like it was going out of fashion.

 

[iak]

1 hour ago, 62613 said:

The France of old, there; complete lack of discipline. They were giving away penalties in the first half like it was going out of fashion.

 

 

Well we don't mind.....

At least Scotland had turned up to take advantage of the dafties behaviour...

[BoD]

And now Saturday's France v Ireland game has been postponed.

Who knows when. or indeed if, this years 6N will be decided?

[rockershovel]

6 minutes ago, BoD said:

And now Saturday's France v Ireland game has been postponed.

Who knows when. or indeed if, this years 6N will be decided?

 

Meanwhile, we see reports of scheduled flights arriving from Italy with no checks of any description..

[rockershovel]

1 hour ago, iak said:

 

Well we don't mind.....

At least Scotland had turned up to take advantage of the dafties behaviour...

 

I thought the whole thing was a sort of parable for England and Scotland. Like it or not, their fates are inextricably linked...

[tigerburnie]

Well it's not exactly the game as I played it, but it was nice to see the game back on even without any spectators, once everyone gets used to the change in law interpretations and the refs remember to be un biased we might get something of interest to watch. For my own team, the trip to Devon went better than I thought, we lost which given where we are is not that much of a surprise, but nice to see some grit and cohesion in the side again. Some odd results around the country, but once players get back to something like match fit, I'm sure it will all settle down again.

[Joseph_Pestell]

6 minutes ago, tigerburnie said:

Well it's not exactly the game as I played it, but it was nice to see the game back on even without any spectators, once everyone gets used to the change in law interpretations and the refs remember to be un biased we might get something of interest to watch. For my own team, the trip to Devon went better than I thought, we lost which given where we are is not that much of a surprise, but nice to see some grit and cohesion in the side again. Some odd results around the country, but once players get back to something like match fit, I'm sure it will all settle down again.

 

Rugby has not been as I played it for a long time. It's even changed a lot in the twenty years since I was refereeing, mostly not for the better.

[rockershovel]

George Ford clearly hasn’t been sitting in the sun in the garden with a g&t ... some good work with the boot, there. 

[tigerburnie]

I feel this current string of games are proving a lottery, first teams against 2/3rd teams doesn't really show anyone much really, firstly I bet fellow Tigers fans were not allowed in to watch men against boys and it could just result in either players losing confidence and going backwards, or even where big mis-matches occur, someone is going to get injured.

[tigerburnie]

Not often I get to celebrate a Tigers win, the Bunnahbain will taste even nicer later on.

[tigerburnie]

Seems Northampton have run out of props, anyone still got their boots and fancy a game?

[tigerburnie]

A real shame Tigers game against Castres is a victim of the virus, we needed the game as part of the build up, oh well a virtual trip to Toulon it is next week then.

[tigerburnie]

I guess for the good of the game in the home nations, it is perhaps acceptable to find Saracens not getting to the final is a good outcome, what they did was a cynical attempt to cheat the rest of the 6 nations clubs out of a fair level playing field. It was just as bad as the Scots/Welsh/Irish and Italians that used to get automatic places in the cup competitions without having to actually qualify. We should hopefully see some genuine open competition now, subject to covid not killing the game off financially, some clubs must be sweating without paying fans.

[Hal Nail]

19 hours ago, tigerburnie said:

some clubs must be sweating without paying fans.

 

Perhaps Ealing's model isnt so bad afterall....

[rockershovel]

Well THAT was an interesting afternoon and evening. 

 

Italy continue to play 2-man rugby, while Ireland demonstrate by default that two men is enough, if you stop playing because you have already secured the bonus point, but the whistle hasn’t yet blown. Ireland DO demonstrate that Italy’s always-heavy pack can be comprehensively outclassed, if you execute properly. 

 

A couple of really good tries from the Twickenham game. 

 

France demonstrate some high quality execution, including the neatest chip-and-recover, up-and-under kick I’ve seen in a long time. Wales don’t, but do demonstrate some surprising handling fluffs and most unusually for Wales, seem to lose heart at the end. 

 

It’s difficult to say anything sensible about the England/Babarians fiasco, so I won’t even try. 

 

[tigerburnie]

Next weeks games will hopefully live up to expectations.

[rockershovel]

43 minutes ago, tigerburnie said:

Next weeks games will hopefully live up to expectations.

 

Depends on what you expect. England v Italy tends to be a dull slugging match. Expect England to start with a quick score, secure the bonus point and close the game down around the 55 minute mark, probably dozing off in the last quarter to allow a soft Italian try. If they aren’t 6N Champions-elect by a narrow margin, it will be their own fault. How typical of the BBC, that they don’t have the England game... 

 

Wales to shut Scotland down in a dead rubber. 

 

France v Ireland will be the main event. I favour France, but not by much and Irish discipline (and the rolling maul) could well do it for them. 

 

 

Edited October 25, 2020 by rockershovel

[Gopher]

41 minutes ago, rockershovel said:

 

Depends on what you expect. England v Italy tends to be a dull slugging match. Expect England to start with a quick score, secure the bonus point and close the game down around the 55 minute mark, probably dozing off in the last quarter to allow a soft Italian try. If they aren’t 6N Champions-elect by a narrow margin, it will be their own fault. How typical of the BBC, that they don’t have the England game... 

 

Wales to shut Scotland down in a dead rubber. 

 

France v Ireland will be the main event. I favour France, but not by much and Irish discipline (and the rolling maul) could well do it for them. 

 

 

I also favour France, they played some lovely rugby yesterday, albeit helped by some poor Welsh play especially in defence (where is Shaun Edwards when you need him - oh yes part of the French coaching team).  I say that as a fully paid up Welsh rugby fan.  I think Scotland will also be too strong for Wales next week.  England should hammer Italy.         

[rockershovel]

30 minutes ago, Gopher said:

I also favour France, they played some lovely rugby yesterday, albeit helped by some poor Welsh play especially in defence (where is Shaun Edwards when you need him - oh yes part of the French coaching team).  I say that as a fully paid up Welsh rugby fan.  I think Scotland will also be too strong for Wales next week.  England should hammer Italy.         

 

England are in the position that for once, they have an incentive to maximise the score. Usually they just want the bonus point, and no injuries. Italy know that, and they do have a well-known tactic of slowing England down to their level (helped by the England habit of kicking away possession for no good reason). It’s why Chris Ashton shows well against them - they don’t have an answer to his occasional blazing runs, he is a big, strong lad which never hurts against Italy, and his shaky tackling is less important against Italy’s slow handling and limited tactical thinking. 

 

England lack the ability to cope with similar game plans, and tend to lack both flair and execution in detail - as they showed in RWC 2019, when SA had much the same plan and better execution. 

 

Italy might yet influence the outcome of the 6N, and THAT isn’t something you hear very often. They might also influence their own fate, because the financial “suits” are committed to having SOMEONE in the sixth slot in the 6N and don’t really have a credible alternative. It’s obvious that Georgia are being given a chance to challenge Italy for the position, during the forthcoming Autumn Internationals Cup.

 

My expectations of that are low; Georgia don’t impress me, they are no more “another Scotland” than Italy. Scotland know what top-tier Test rugby is about, and are quite capable of producing top level games on occasion; it’s just that they lack the resources to do it consistently. Italy simply can’t, and don’t, and won’t. But the “suits” want the best of their poor bargain with 6N and Italy are probably the “best of the rest”, assuming that allowing a South Seas team isn’t an option. 

 

Japan are occasionally mentioned in this context, but I can’t see it. They burst onto the stage by beating South Africa, and followed that with a spectacular World Cup event. Hosting a short England tour would have been a good follow-up, but of course that didn’t happen. They need to maintain their reputation for producing something out of the ordinary, so I await their next move with considerable interest. 

[rockershovel]

Meanwhile, the BBC keep banging the drum about women’s rugby, for reasons of their own. I can’t find this interesting or exciting, and they don’t seem to be making much general headway.

 

If the RFU or IRB seriously wanted a “second tier” series, which I don’t particularly believe they do, they have a perfectly good alternative - the U20s, who are technically far superior to the women’s game, offer proper scrummaging, can be spectacularly athletic and would run rings around them on the pitch. There are also the Saxons, who seem to be lost in the limbo created by the de-facto promotion of most of their opponents to full international sides, courtesy of the RWC. 

 

 

[rockershovel]

Well THAT was an interesting afternoon...

 

I can only agree with SCW’s comment at half-time, that England had spent the first half kicking away possession to no obvious purpose, on average every two minutes - 18 times in the first half, the highest count of any team in the tournament, by a considerable margin. That isn’t a recipe for success, at this level. They also conceded a very easy try to Italy and came close to handing them another. 

 

However England’s habitual plan of under-performing at huge expense seems to be creaking along, crowning them champions by virtue of some closely-reasoned arithmetic (speaking of which, the lack of sense of occasion doesn’t work for me at all).

 

Wales v Scotland was an entertaining game, I thought; a good advert for the tournament. 

 

Ireland fell short in France, by (among other things) two obvious, deliberate fouls, one of which cost them a penalty try and one which nearly did. This isn’t good enough. France were very classy when it mattered and will bear watching next season, for sure. 

 

 

[Fat Controller]

3 minutes ago, rockershovel said:

Well THAT was an interesting afternoon...

 

I can only agree with SCW’s comment at half-time, that England had spent the first half kicking away possession to no obvious purpose, on average every two minutes - 18 times in the first half, the highest count of any team in the tournament, by a considerable margin. That isn’t a recipe for success, at this level. They also conceded a very easy try to Italy and came close to handing them another. 

 

However England’s habitual plan of under-performing at huge expense seems to be creaking along, crowning them champions by virtue of some closely-reasoned arithmetic (speaking of which, the lack of sense of occasion doesn’t work for me at all).

 

Wales v Scotland was an entertaining game, I thought; a good advert for the tournament. 

 

Ireland fell short in France, by (among other things) two obvious, deliberate fouls, one of which cost them a penalty try and one which nearly did. This isn’t good enough. France were very classy when it mattered and will bear watching next season, for sure. 

 

 

I don't think I've seen France playing with such discipline and team-spirit for a long time. So often, in the past, they have played as 15 disparate individuals who seem to have turned up at the same venue by chance.