Young People's view of the hobby

[mdvle]

The podcast A Modeler's Life recently did an episode discussing whether the hobby is dying, the lack of young people, ...

 

So they discuss the issue with a 21 year old, 22 year old, and recent University graduate.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qpzu6q4CYCg

 

[ Note the last 25 minutes is a different discussion]

 

While it is American oriented, there are likely some universal truths.  Some items:

 

- if a club layout is DC, they aren't interested.  The young want DCC.

- if older modelers aren't on Facebook, then they can't communicate with the young people.

- people are entering the hobby without first having trains as a kid, part of what brings them in is memories of a grandparent having trains.

 

Indirectly mentioned in this podcast, but the nature of participation is also changing in the US.  While many traditional train shows are dying, the RPM (Railway Prototype Modelers) concept is growing with existing meets seeing increasing attendance and new meets being started.

[RedgateModels]

 

- if older modelers aren't on Facebook, then they can't communicate with the young people.

 

 

Maybe different in the UK but as far as the young are concerned that I come into contact with (kids and their friends, so 15 to 16 year olds) Facebook is for "old people", Snapchat and Instagram rule.

 

Could be that the demographic is different even with teenagers

Edited November 5, 2018 by RedgateModels

[Spitfire2865]

Id doubt the "required" DCC idea.  

Im one of them American youths.

I can see the thought process, DCC= computers which them youngins always want.  But thats not what modelling is about.  Its about...building models. 

Also, young people arent using Facebook.  Nor are they sharing their creative sides on other social medias.  Thats what forums and messageboards are for.  If you can spread the word of modelling forums, showing the younger audience that there is a large digital community they can join, that would probably go a long way to convincing some people to join.  When I actually look, I find modelling boards Ive never heard of.  But theyre often so outdated in style and structure its hard to navigate.  Straight out of the late 90s when the likes of RMWeb or WesternThunder have modern updated webpages with easy to use UI's.

 

Then you get into the real issue, life in general isnt as easy as it used to be.  With inflation, squeezing debt, and lifestyles with less and less free time, you are bound to find more and more people without a time sink hobby or who would WANT to join but cant afford it due to more important concerns.  

 

The interest is always there, its just convincing people their time, money, and energy CAN be put to modelling use.  And sometimes, it just cant.  

[RedGemAlchemist]

Speaking as a 25 year old working exclusively in DC and mostly in old Triang I'd like to point out that there are some exceptions. Few, but some.

[GreenGiraffe22]

Don't know if I still count as youthul now I'm 27, but I have no idea how DCC works :') it's only in the past year I found out what it was...

[Lacathedrale]

I'm 33 and have bounced off this hobby a number of times in the last 15 years, each time being told that it's dying out and young people aren't interested. I don't think that's strictly true (and as per the Great Model Railway Challenge thread I think this contraction is heading back towards a natural equilibrium after a surge in the young transpotter -> retiree paradigm, rather than towards the abyss).

 

In my opnion the only thing that is really,  holding it back participation by younger folk is a generally conservative attitude towards new practises and patterrns. It can't be all laid at the individual decision makers - the market in the UK is smaller than the US and with far more one-man-shop outfits for the myriad of sprockets and whizzbangs. Smaller spaces push modellers towards diorama-style layouts instead of operationally interesting ones.

[jjb1970]

DC or DCC, both equally obsolete in many ways, I'd expect the more technically savvy to be looking at possibilities beyond DCC involving power onboard. One thing I do think is that model clubs and even model shows shouldn't be treated as a barometer of the health of the hobby. I am not in a club, very rarely attend shows and know a lot of modellers who do the same, I think the lone home modeller segment is easy to ignore but it probably a much bigger part of the hobby than many recognise.

[Lacathedrale]

Just because new entrants to the hobby are more tech savvy it doesn't mean they have to be innovators - that's a separate discussion IMO.

[RedGemAlchemist]

Just because new entrants to the hobby are more tech savvy it doesn't mean they have to be innovators - that's a separate discussion IMO.

My thoughts exactly. And just because they know this stuff doesn't mean they will. Look at me, going deliberately old school.

[jjb1970]

Just because new entrants to the hobby are more tech savvy it doesn't mean they have to be innovators - that's a separate discussion IMO.

 

No doubt about that. However DC is often pointed to as being old hat and unattractive to the technically savvy (of any age) who want modern technology. If that is the case then DCC isn't really new tech any more than DC and the advantages of simplified wiring aren't as clear cut as marketing PR suggests.

[Lacathedrale]

DCC is an obvious evolution from DC and provides vastly more functionality and interconnectivity. We're not talking about the difference between pen and quill (which you seem to be implying), we are talking about pen and smartphone.  Some people may of course choose to eschew it for whatever reasons they desire but the vast majority (of  layouts which are trend-setters i.e. New Junction, Old Oak Common, Everard Junction, etc. at least).

[davefromacrossthepond]

To put things in perspective.  I do a podcast "Established Railway Modellers View of the Hobby" and interview 3 RMWebbers.  Would there be any "universal truths" that we could pull?  I dare say I don't think we could pull any from any one thread here be it "DCC or DC" "OO or EM" "RTR or kit."  Trying to box any group especially something as broad as "young non railway modellers" is quite the challenge indeed.

[trustytrev]

Hello,

       I think an interest in history is sadly lacking in today's  "yoof" which automatically lessens any likely enthusiasm in railways.

A young person once asked SWMBO at work "What is a monarch?"

A sad reflection on education today.

trustytrev.

[The Johnster]

Well, I've been around a long time now, which in one way precludes me from making any useful contribution to a discussion about yoof in the hobby.  But I have been listening to the same sort of doom mongers for over 5 decades moaning about the attitude of the current crop of youngsters, their lack of a rounded education, and their alleged desire to have everything done for them because their attention span and patience cannot cut the mustard in a hobby where precision work, a methodical approach, and manual skills which take time to develop.  I fully expect anyone who is of that current crop of youngsters to be able to echo my comments in another 50 years or so on whatever the equivalent of this is by then.

 

Every generation blames the one before and despairs of the one after.  Listen to Spitfire post 3, everyone; he's one of 'em and sounds to me as if he is intelligent and perceptive, and knows what he's talking about, even though he doesn't yet have the perspective to see that life in general was never as easy as it used to be; for the entire history of the hobby homes have been getting progressively smaller and space for layouts more at a premium; the trade keeps coming up with smaller scales but the trade off is that when you go down a scale you go back about 30 years in the standard of detail and performance.

Edited November 6, 2018 by The Johnster

[Lacathedrale]

Hello,

       I think an interest in history is sadly lacking in today's  "yoof" which automatically lessens any likely enthusiasm in railways.

A young person once asked SWMBO at work "What is a monarch?"

A sad reflection on education today.

trustytrev.

 

The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room.

- Socrates (469-399 B.C.)

[RedGemAlchemist]

 

The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. - Socrates (469-399 B.C.)

In short, teenagers have always been like this because they're teenagers.

[Lacathedrale]

To put things in perspective.  I do a podcast "Established Railway Modellers View of the Hobby" and interview 3 RMWebbers.  Would there be any "universal truths" that we could pull?  I dare say I don't think we could pull any from any one thread here be it "DCC or DC" "OO or EM" "RTR or kit."  Trying to box any group especially something as broad as "young non railway modellers" is quite the challenge indeed.

 

There will always be a vocal minority who  buck the trend, but I think you would not be far off the mark by saying that in vogue right now with people who are newer in the hobby but taking it somewhat seriously (as opposed to choo-choos on the carpet) would be DCC controlled, 00 gauge, late BR Blue/Sectorisation/Privatisation. I see SO MUCH NSE.

 

I think this is the strange result of a few factors:

- the south east and London  has some of the most dense trackage  in the country, means that the people with the most 'railway' experience are those in those areas

- there is no freight to speak of, so passenger services (with big passing unit trains) are front and centre, which again reinforces urban/suburban railways

- there appears to be a desire to model 'twenty years ago', probably because those who were young then are seeng the fruits of employment and have a little disposable income.

 

'Roundy round' on the carpet seems to have turned into 'roundy round on the shelves of a garage, with a through station and/or TMD'

[PatB]

Just on the DCC being up to date thing, if we take the introduction of Hornby Zero 1 as being the dawn of practical (ie commercially supported and available to the average modeller rather than the advanced specialist) DCC c1980, and the introduction of the Rovex range to represent the same for 2-rail DC, it's noteworthy that DCC is now older than 2-rail DC was when its eventual replacement came along. The main difference seems to be that 2-rail became pretty much universal much more quickly than has been the case with DCC.

[Zomboid]

I think it's important to realise that what gets someone through the door (as it were) is not necessarily the same thing that keeps them there.

 

It was not switching with sound fitted American HO locos which encouraged me to rekindle the interest (it was actually seeing somehow that there were RTP buildings available for the GCR London extension), but that's what's encouraged me to maintain the interest.

 

Let's not let this thread descend into the DC/ DCC war...

[Corbs]

I found myself wondering if there were any podcasts for modellers and railway enthusiasts the other day, thanks for the link!

I don’t think I qualify as young any more now I’m 31 but I did re-enter the hobby 5 years ago at 26. The spark never died, but it was disposable income, a stable place to live, and the drop in social stigma that allowed me to come out of my shell. I’d always been publicly embarrassed about being into railways as a kid, it wasn’t cool, but now the kind of people I hang around with are really encouraging of hobbies and think it’s awesome that I go and play with steam locos at the weekend and create things in my spare time.

Part of me wonders if social media and being connected via forums etc. actually allows kids to indulge more in their hobby and talk to like minded people. When I was a bairn there was no-one my age who was into it really, or maybe we were all just hiding for fear of being outed?

[grahame]

Maybe different in the UK but as far as the young are concerned that I come into contact with (kids and their friends, so 15 to 16 year olds) Facebook is for "old people", Snapchat and Instagram rule

Yep, I heard on the radio news the other day that many people are actually ditching Facebook and they've lost over 1m accounts in recent weeks (as well as all the auto ones deleted in the US).

 

G

['CHARD]

I think an interest in history is sadly lacking in today's  "yoof" which automatically lessens any likely enthusiasm in railways.

A young person once asked SWMBO at work "What is a monarch?"

A sad reflection on education today.

 

 

To a degree yes it is a sad reflection on education, although I hear the massed ranks of the wise opining 'twas ever thus'.  I offer this personal nonecdote though; on Sunday my 18 y/o son who has recently started at Uni mentioned how he was discontented that at school/ college he had been denied the chance to study History because of the way their subject choices were configured in Sixth Form.  He commented: 'I've always loved history, that's why my favourite days-out are to castles and stately homes, and why I watch hours and hours of video on the history channel.' His girlfriend then asked: 'Is this why you can spot former asylums and mental hospitals?'  Which is true - he pointed out at least three on the A6 between Bakewell and Derby!!!   

 

Given the opportunity, nurturing and an access route, enquiring minds will research anything that takes their fancy - I think nowadays we have to realise that 'education' with a capital 'E' won't necessarily do that for young people, it is geared to the essentials for functioning (the 3 Rs) with a generous helping of League Table performance thrown in. 

 

Well, I've been around a long time now, which in one way precludes me from making any useful contribution to a discussion about yoof in the hobby.  But I have been listening to the same sort of doom mongers for over 5 decades moaning about the attitude of the current crop of youngsters, their lack of a rounded education, and their alleged desire to have everything done for them because their attention span and patience cannot cut the mustard in a hobby where precision work, a methodical approach, and manual skills which take time to develop.  I fully expect anyone who is of that current crop of youngsters to be able to echo my comments in another 50 years or so on whatever the equivalent of this is by then.

 

Every generation blames the one before and despairs of the one after.  Listen to Spitfire post 3, everyone; he's one of 'em and sounds to me as if he is intelligent and perceptive, and knows what he's talking about, even though he doesn't yet have the perspective to see that life in general was never as easy as it used to be....

 

Welcome to my world mate; agree with that entire piece - it reads like 'Introduction from the Editor' - brilliant!  Do you do any mentoring???  

[dvdlcs]

Hello,

       I think an interest in history is sadly lacking in today's  "yoof" which automatically lessens any likely enthusiasm in railways.

A young person once asked SWMBO at work "What is a monarch?"

A sad reflection on education today.

trustytrev.

 

A monarch is a type of butterfly.

 

Is that the answer you were looking for?

 

:-)

[Devo63]

A monarch is a type of butterfly.

 

Is that the answer you were looking for?

 

:-)

No - a Monarch is a re-named GWR King series Star class locomotive.

[woodenhead]

There are a lot of railway and model railway themed groups on Facebook - but unless you look for them you are not going to find them.

 

Sadly I am not sure where the manufacturers stand in all this - people today especially younger people have less disposable income and less space - what are Dapol/Heljan really pushing - O Gauge - this is squarely aimed at the legion of baby boomers with now empty nests and spare cash to burn.  Yes i know there are quite a lot of middle aged people into O gauge now, but I don't think Dapol or Heljan were ever thinking new entrants to model railways.

 

A typical youth isn't going to fall into railway modelling, likely they will have been introduced to it from a family member or a friend - if there are less of them about (which is true) then it is going to mean less people to influence the next generation.  No amount of DCC and flashing light shenanigans is going to simply turn someone into a railway modeller.