Oiling coach and wagon axleboxes in the steam era

[Ben Alder]

I am at present building a grounded van that was used by the C&W dept at Thurso - I know this because the body was graced with a metal sign saying so - and it led to a train of thought about the general oiling of rolling stock at stations and its frequency. How often was this necessary and whose job was it? I remember the wheel tapper at work but do not have any recollection of who attended to lubrication. Presumably it must have been a local job, especially with wagons who were not subject to the same level of attention as carriages, and photos of this van usually have an oil drum or two lying about beside it, leading me to the assumption that it was their responsibility, or had the guard to check that stock was adequately lubricated for running?

 

Any insights on this would be appreciated.

[Guy Rixon]

When goods and mineral vehicles had greased axleboxes, I understand that it was necessary to stop the train perhaps every 20 miles and check the axleboxes for overheating. I presume that the bearings got re-greased at these inspections. Grease boxes seem to have had a reservoir of grease on top that flowed down over the journal and was lost as it dripped off the bottom, hence a need to top up often.

 

One of the advantages of changing to oil boxes was to run further between inspections. I don't know if oil boxes needed to be refilled once per trip, or once per week or what. The drawings I've seen of oil boxes show a bottom reservoir supplying oil to a sponge that wipes it onto the bottom of the journal. This looks like a way to retain the oil so that it needs infrequent topping up.

[The Johnster]

Trains were examined by Carriage and Wagon Dept. examiners before they left their point of origin; the examiner signed the Train Preparation Slip which was handed to the train's guard by the yard foreman and which was his authority to take the train out.  The guard then filled out the Driver's Load Slip and signed it, having ascertained to his satisfaction that all was well and that his brake van had been properly prepared and equipped.

 

The C & W examiner carried a pot of oil around the train with him (he had to check both sides) and topped up the dashpots in the axleboxes, so a wagon got it's axlebox topped up at the start of every journey, at least in theory.  In practice things did not always happen like that, for instance at Cwmbargoed in the South Wales valleys, the local sheep had learned how to flip the top of the axlebox open with their noses and ate the contents, so that trains squealed to a seized up halt about 2 miles down the valley.

 

Part of the guard's job was to keep an eye out for hot axle boxes en route, and a nose as well as your first indication was usually a smell of burned oil and hot metal.  In extreme cases the brakes had to be pinned down hard to stop the axle revolving and the wagon had to be dragged slowly to a point that it could be shunted off before the train could continue.  This would lead to replacement of the wheelset which would be damaged beyond repair.

[AberdeenBill]

for instance at Cwmbargoed in the South Wales valleys, the local sheep had learned how to flip the top of the axlebox open with their noses and ate the contents, so that trains squealed to a seized up halt about 2 miles down the valley.

 

 

Great story about the "wrong kind of sheep"

 

Bill

[Compound2632]

at Cwmbargoed in the South Wales valleys, the local sheep had learned how to flip the top of the axlebox open with their noses and ate the contents, so that trains squealed to a seized up halt about 2 miles down the valley.

 

That was in the days of grease boxes I assume. In Keith Montague's Gloucester wagon book, there's an account of the difficulties encountered with rolling stock supplied to Russia in the 1860s - the formula of the grease had to be changed as art first it was poisonous to the peasants who ate it.

Edited October 22, 2018 by Compound2632

[Wickham Green]

, for instance at Cwmbargoed in the South Wales valleys, the local sheep had learned how to flip the top of the axlebox open with their noses and ate the contents, so that trains squealed to a seized up halt about 2 miles down the valley.

 

 

I always understood it was rats that ate the grease an' scuppered Brunels's atmospheric plans - maybe they had Cwmbargoed sheep there too ??!?

[Guy Rixon]

The rats ate the leather sealing strip on top of the atmospheric railway's pipe. Rats will eat almost anything (except potatoes). 

[Reorte]

Part of the guard's job was to keep an eye out for hot axle boxes en route, and a nose as well as your first indication was usually a smell of burned oil and hot metal. In extreme cases the brakes had to be pinned down hard to stop the axle revolving and the wagon had to be dragged slowly to a point that it could be shunted off before the train could continue. This would lead to replacement of the wheelset which would be damaged beyond repair.

What could the guard actually do when he smelled burned oil until the train was scheduled to stop anyway? Did he have some means of communication with the driver (can't think what that could've been though)?

[jwealleans]

Repeated applications of the brake was they usual way to attract attention, wasn't it?

[Oldddudders]

Repeated applications of the brake was they usual way to attract attention, wasn't it?

 

Not so many continuously-braked trains in them thar days, presumably, so screwing down the handbrake and waving a flag hopefully were about his only options.

[Mark Saunders]

Repeated applications of the brake was they usual way to attract attention, wasn't it?

Nothing had changed till the end of class 9 unfitted trains!

 

Mark Saunders

[The Bigbee Line]

Reversing the side lamps to show reds to the driver........

[Compound2632]

Reversing the side lamps to show reds to the driver........

 

How often did the driver or fireman look back?

[The Bigbee Line]

All the while you had flames you were ok. When it stopped burning you knew all the oil was gone. Years ago the C&W walked a 16t minfit to Swanley. When we arrived in the siding the box was almost transparent with the heat. The station supervisor came out “you can’t leave that there” (in the up siding). “F@@k off, it’s staying where it is.....”

Edited October 22, 2018 by The Bigbee Line

[The Bigbee Line]

How often did the driver or fireman look back?

Depends how good the driver was. The guard could indicate to signal boxes that the train was in distress. That’s if there was a box......

[Wickham Green]

The rats ate the leather sealing strip ............

............... which was sealed with tallow.

[The Johnster]

And something called gutta-percha, which the rats also liked.

 

Loco crews were supposed to 'keep a sharp lookout', which included looking back along the train at suitable curved locations where you could get a good view of it.  They were also supposed to look back for the 'tip' from the guard to show they were clear of temporary or permanent speed restrictions, and the better ones did. but not all drivers were as good as they should have been. Of course, if the train is single manned, the driver cannot observe the right hand side of it.

 

But a hot box is pretty obvious; there is smoke, flames, and smell, and a train will not go far before being pulled up after this has been observed by the guard, or loco crew, or a passing train, or a signalman, or staff on a station the train passes, or yard staff somewhere, or a per way man.

[Wickham Green]

And something called gutta-percha, which the rats also liked.

 

Loco crews were supposed to 'keep a sharp lookout', which included looking back along the train at suitable curved locations where you could get a good view of it.  They were also supposed to look back for the 'tip' from the guard to show they were clear of temporary or permanent speed restrictions, and the better ones did. but not all drivers were as good as they should have been. Of course, if the train is single manned, the driver cannot observe the right hand side of it.

 

But a hot box is pretty obvious; there is smoke, flames, and smell, and a train will not go far before being pulled up after this has been observed by the guard, or loco crew, or a passing train, or a signalman, or staff on a station the train passes, or yard staff somewhere, or a per way man.

Good job we've got Hot Box Detectors nowadays then  -  cos there are no guards nor signalmen ( within sight of the railway ) and station or yard staff & p-way men are few and far between.

 

Gutta-percha was the stuff they used to put in the centre of golf balls - some form of rubber compound .......... it's probably banned by now.

[uax6]

Not all signalling is done from power boxes you know. I look out of the box windows and see every train that goes past, and I have found a fair number of defects over the years....

 

Andy G

[Spitfire2865]

Something to consider, the flip top axlebox was a very much welcome invention.  Quite the annoyance having to lug a wrench or two down both sides of the train and undo and redo hundreds of bolts a day.  Even worse for early America where each car had twice the number of axleboxes and many more miles between stops.  

[The Johnster]

We had axle box detectors in my day, back in the 70s; the one at Oakle Street, just down from Gloucester on the SWML, was famous for picking up the brake van stove.  When you counted the axles, because the detector's would tell you whin axle it was numbered from the front. it would always be the last or last but one; the brake van!  They'd pick up dragging brakes as well; great idea!

 

They were a direct response to the lack of signalmen on MAS routes to observe passing trains.  You would be stopped at Over Jc on the up, and as soon as you saw the driver or secondman walking back down the train, you'd know what had happened, and would walk forward to tell him there was no hot box and it was just that you'd got the stove going well.  And we'd 'ave 'em going like blast furnaces on cold nights. red or even orange hot so that they would part melt and have a little bulge in the middle below the door where they'd 'settled'.

 

Much like myself in later years, but that's down to the beer and chips, not heat...

Edited October 22, 2018 by The Johnster

[The Stationmaster]

I am at present building a grounded van that was used by the C&W dept at Thurso - I know this because the body was graced with a metal sign saying so - and it led to a train of thought about the general oiling of rolling stock at stations and its frequency. How often was this necessary and whose job was it? I remember the wheel tapper at work but do not have any recollection of who attended to lubrication. Presumably it must have been a local job, especially with wagons who were not subject to the same level of attention as carriages, and photos of this van usually have an oil drum or two lying about beside it, leading me to the assumption that it was their responsibility, or had the guard to check that stock was adequately lubricated for running?

 

Any insights on this would be appreciated.

 

Oiling was carried out either by a C&W Examiner or at most locations by a grade of C&W staff entitled C&W Greasers - although they were still called Greasers long after Grease axleboxes had vanished.  The title wasn't actually abolished until the BR Pay & Efficiency review of conciliation staff grade structures in 1967/68 although by then they were often referred to as 'Oilers & Greasers'.  Oddly C&W Examiners and Greasers were not workshop staff and fell into the same grade area as the likes of Porters and Shunters although they were in a different Promotion Diagram and post P&E Oilers & Greasers were reclassified as Railmen, the basic Conciliation staff grade (Promotion Diagrams also changed massively following the P& E review).  Equally following P&E C&W Examiners could be used for oiling duties so many of the former Greaser/Oiler & Greaser/Oiler jobs vanished except at the busiest locations.

 

I only ever knowingly came across one former Greaser and he had risen through the ranks to become an Area Manager (at Cardiff Newtown) and he must have been near unique in that level of promotion over his career.

[Simon Lee]

The Night Ferry coaches were examined and oiled if required before loading and after offloading from the Train Ferry.

 

Interestingly the "Oiler Boy" who attended the inaugural service,was the C&W examiner for the last outward and last inward services in 1980.

[The Bigbee Line]

The Night Ferry coaches were examined and oiled if required before loading and after offloading from the Train Ferry.

 

Interestingly the "Oiler Boy" who attended the inaugural service,was the C&W examiner for the last outward and last inward services in 1980.

 

Happy days Simon, In the ferry the 'tappers' always had an oil bucket and brush handy, never saw a dry coupling.  When the tunnel came along, nobody wanted to know about all the useful work they did.........

[Wickham Green]

We had axle box detectors in my day, back in the 70s; the one at Oakle Street, just down from Gloucester on the SWML, was famous for picking up the brake van stove.  When you counted the axles, because the detector's would tell you whin axle it was numbered from the front. it would always be the last or last but one; the brake van!  They'd pick up dragging brakes as well; great idea!

 

They were a direct response to the lack of signalmen on MAS routes to observe passing trains.  You would be stopped at Over Jc on the up, and as soon as you saw the driver or secondman walking back down the train, you'd know what had happened, and would walk forward to tell him there was no hot box and it was just that you'd got the stove going well.  And we'd 'ave 'em going like blast furnaces on cold nights. red or even orange hot so that they would part melt and have a little bulge in the middle below the door where they'd 'settled'.

 

Much like myself in later years, but that's down to the beer and chips, not heat...

The current detectors are very good at detecting steam locos too - not necessarily the firebox as you might expect but the cylinder drain cocks have been found to trip them ............... for many years the R.P.S.I. could never get past Cherryville Junction without an un-scheduled stop but - fingers crossed - a solution's been found !