sp4294 Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 Hello from across the pond in Western Canada! Please excuse this post if it has been asked before (I couldn't find a related thread), but I am wondering if there is a historical consist list of the Pullman carriages that would be found on the Devon Belle during the early post-Nationalization period? I know the cars listed in the appropriate Hornby packs, but since there were usually twelve carriages on any given day, I am looking for an accurate list for modeling purposes. The Southern Railway E-Group webpage doesn't list actual consists AFAIK. Any help would be appreciated. cheers Stefan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 The information is on there. In the Pullman section there are issues of Coupe News. Well worth a look at if you have interest in Pullmans. http://www.semgonline.com/coach/coupe/index.html I think this is the relevant issue. Although there are other bits of information elsewhere. http://www.semgonline.com/coach/coupe/coupe_se02.pdf Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium John Isherwood Posted September 29, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 29, 2018 (edited) Hello from across the pond in Western Canada! Please excuse this post if it has been asked before (I couldn't find a related thread), but I am wondering if there is a historical consist list of the Pullman carriages that would be found on the Devon Belle during the early post-Nationalization period? I know the cars listed in the appropriate Hornby packs, but since there were usually twelve carriages on any given day, I am looking for an accurate list for modeling purposes. The Southern Railway E-Group webpage doesn't list actual consists AFAIK. Any help would be appreciated. cheers Stefan Now this is where I will get shot down in flames ..... ..... but I will nevertheless suggest that the word 'consist' is a (from the UK point of view) Transatlantic concept not used in the UK during the 'classic' period of railways. Whenever I see the word 'consist' in a posting, I don't have to look at the location of the author - it screams "America / Canada (perhaps Antipodean?)" at me. ..... unless you know different, of course! Regards, John Isherwood. Edited September 30, 2018 by cctransuk Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianusa Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 Thanks for an interesting site, never knew of it before! I was only twelve when it first appeared at Friary station, but old enough to realise it was something special but it was a shame there was no obs car on the rear! Brian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted September 29, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 29, 2018 (edited) Thanks for an interesting site, never knew of it before! I was only twelve when it first appeared at Friary station, but old enough to realise it was something special but it was a shame there was no obs car on the rear! Brian. The observation car was "always" in the Ilfracombe portion of the train, though I'm eagerly awaiting the pictures demonstrating the folly of being categorical about it. Before my time anyway as my mode of transport was still a push-chair when the Belle ceased to run. John Edited September 29, 2018 by Dunsignalling Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianusa Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 (edited) It would seem today that the difference in railway words is fading slowly, hence 'consist, freight train, train station', etc, are becoming universal on the news and in print media even from UK railway companies and enthusiasts. Brian. Edited September 29, 2018 by brianusa 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Graham_Muz Posted September 29, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 29, 2018 (edited) The Devon Belle whilst short lived lasted beyond 1948 t was introduced by the Southern Railway on 20th June 1947 and lasted until September 1954. As stated above the observation car was used on the Ilfracombe portion only, the Plymouth portion ceased operating in 1950. The observation cars were occasionally used on special tours on the Southern Region before being transferred to midland and Scottish regions. Edited October 3, 2018 by Graham_Muz Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted September 29, 2018 Share Posted September 29, 2018 It would seem today that the difference in railway words is fading slowly, hence 'consist, freight train, train station', etc, are becoming universal on the news and in print media even from UK railway companies and enthusiasts. Brian. Not on my watch they're not! Yes, I know that's off American cop shows before anyone points it out. Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted September 30, 2018 Share Posted September 30, 2018 Now this is where I will get shot down in flames ..... ..... but I will nevertheless suggest that the word 'consist' is a (from the UK point of view) Transatlantic concept not used in the UK during the 'classic' period of railways. Whenever I see the word 'consist' in a posting, I don't have to look at the location of the author - it screams "America / Canada (perhaps Antipodean?)" at me. ..... unless you know different, of course! Regards, John Isherwood. I loath the word too much preferring rake which is the traditional British word Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sp4294 Posted October 2, 2018 Author Share Posted October 2, 2018 Jason The information is on there. In the Pullman section there are issues of Coupe News. Well worth a look at if you have interest in Pullmans. http://www.semgonline.com/coach/coupe/index.html I think this is the relevant issue. Although there are other bits of information elsewhere. http://www.semgonline.com/coach/coupe/coupe_se02.pdf Jason Indeed it was there all along. Thanks so much for that link. I hadn't seen it on their website. Much appreciated! cheers Stefan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sp4294 Posted October 2, 2018 Author Share Posted October 2, 2018 Now this is where I will get shot down in flames ..... ..... but I will nevertheless suggest that the word 'consist' is a (from the UK point of view) Transatlantic concept not used in the UK during the 'classic' period of railways. Whenever I see the word 'consist' in a posting, I don't have to look at the location of the author - it screams "America / Canada (perhaps Antipodean?)" at me. ..... unless you know different, of course! Regards, John Isherwood. Indeed, the term "rake" is unheard of over here. For argument sake, it could be argued that "consist" is a more precise term. cheers Stefan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hayfield Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 The Devon Belle whilst short lived lasted beyond 1848 t was introduced by the Southern Railway on 20th June 1947 and lasted until September 1954. As stated above the observation car was used on the Ilfracombe portion only, the Plymouth portion ceased operating in 1950. The observation cars were occasionally used on special tours on the Southern Region before being transferred to midland and Scottish regions. Going slightly off topic, a couple of weeks ago my wife and I rode in the Dartmouth Steam Railway's observation car from Kingswear to Paignton as the first carriage behind the loco, initially I thought of these carriages as being at the end of the train, but the view going forward despite the loco being in front was excellent. Bit of a simple question, were they always run at the rear and if so I guess had to be turned round and change ends for each journey Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris45lsw Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Going slightly off topic, a couple of weeks ago my wife and I rode in the Dartmouth Steam Railway's observation car from Kingswear to Paignton as the first carriage behind the loco, initially I thought of these carriages as being at the end of the train, but the view going forward despite the loco being in front was excellent. Bit of a simple question, were they always run at the rear and if so I guess had to be turned round and change ends for each journey Yes, the observation car was turned on the Ilfracombe loco turntable. Chris KT Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wickham Green Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Yes, the observation car was turned on the Ilfracombe loco turntable. Chris KT Indeed - and there are published photos .............. but I can't recall how / where it was turned at the London end. ( I think the stock was stabled a Clapham - but there were no turning facilities there ..... and, of course the Obo has to be taken off one end of the rake and reattached to the other end too : sounds complex and expensive in loco power ..... no wonder it didn't last too long.) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hayfield Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 I think the expensive bit was only a few seats in the car plus a bar, must admit beats commuting every time, sitting in an armchair with oodles of leg room is shear indulgence, pity the bar was closed. Instead of an extra £5 why not an extra £10 which includes a glass of bubbly 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Indeed, the term "rake" is unheard of over here. For argument sake, it could be argued that "consist" is a more precise term. cheers Stefan It's unheard of over here as well. It's a term made up by Railway Modellers I'm afraid. I've never heard a proper railwayman use it. If they do it's because they have learnt it from enthusiasts. The correct terms are train which is a bit vague or set which is usually a fixed formation. Formation is also used and probably closest to using consist as it's more a specified set of carriages used for a specific train. http://www.crecy.co.uk/lner-passenger-train-formations-vol-2 Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianusa Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 It's unheard of over here as well. It's a term made up by Railway Modellers I'm afraid. I've never heard a proper railwayman use it. If they do it's because they have learnt it from enthusiasts. The correct terms are train which is a bit vague or set which is usually a fixed formation. Formation is also used and probably closest to using consist as it's more a specified set of carriages used for a specific train. http://www.crecy.co.uk/lner-passenger-train-formations-vol-2 Jason Don't know where Jason's 'over here' is, but I rather think he's right as I first learned of 'rakes' when joined a train club back home many years ago. I learned of 'consist' over here in the US along with other American railroad terminology but on sites such as this I use the English terms. Don't wish to upset the locals! Brian. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Graham_Muz Posted October 3, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 3, 2018 (edited) Sorry, fat fingers on phone syndrome, post now duly corrected. Edited October 3, 2018 by Graham_Muz Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now