Coaching stock used by 1200 Falcon on the Western Region

[TravisM]

I recently bought a Heljan 1200 Falcon in BR blue and I wondered what the coaching stock would have been used when it did the Bristol/Paddington diagrams?  Was it early Mk 2's or mainly Mk 1's and what was the train reporting marks?

[TheSignalEngineer]

I've seen pictures of it with 1A22 and 1A32 at the Paddington end. There are several pictures on Flickr IIRC You may have to search for Class 53.

[TravisM]

I've seen pictures of it with 1A22 and 1A32 at the Paddington end. There are several pictures on Flickr IIRC You may have to search for Class 53.

 

Also with 1A09 but I'd didn't know if it was used solely on that train or any Bristol/Paddington working.  Any idea of it's return working reporting mark was?  Also, did it ever do a Paddington/Weston-super-Mare working?

[TheSignalEngineer]

Don't know off-hand. Several of the Bristol shots it was still in two-tone livery. Later it seemd to stray to South Wales on freights. Pictures of it on unfitted trains at Newport in Blue turn up. There's also a picture of it on Pullman stock on the net.

[The Johnster]

Not given Blue livery until it was sold to BR and given a TOPS number, 1200.  IIRC it was taken off passenger work at that time and allocated to Ebbw Junction for use on the Newport Docks-Llanwern iron ore trains; 35ton loose fitted hoppers, and very heavy work!  As D0280 at Bath Road if worked with stock ranging from mk1s in the early days through the various mk2s up to but not including air conditioned ETH stock, but Bristol-Paddington trains always had up to date stock, so it depends fairly closely on your period, but as your model depicts it as 1200, the iron ore work is about it, though it did run to Ebbw Vale on other steel traffic. 

 

I get the impression this is not what you want to hear, in which case I sympathise and commend Rule 1!

 

IIRC, and I don't always so it is worth checking, the timetable changes that had Paddington-Bristol traffic extended to Weston Super Mare occurred at the time that the airconditioned ETH stock came into use, the idea being to release the platform quickly at Temple Meads on the down working and send the stock out of the way at a time when Malago Vale was busy, so D0280 would have been in South Wales by then.  I should know this, as it occurred during my time on the railway, but have forgotten in my dotage...

Edited February 15, 2018 by The Johnster

[TravisM]

Not given Blue livery until it was sold to BR and given a TOPS number, 1200.  IIRC it was taken off passenger work at that time and allocated to Ebbw Junction for use on the Newport Docks-Llanwern iron ore trains; 35ton loose fitted hoppers, and very heavy work!  As D0280 at Bath Road if worked with stock ranging from mk1s in the early days through the various mk2s up to but not including air conditioned ETH stock, but Bristol-Paddington trains always had up to date stock, so it depends fairly closely on your period, but as your model depicts it as 1200, the iron ore work is about it, though it did run to Ebbw Vale on other steel traffic. 

 

I get the impression this is not what you want to hear, in which case I sympathise and commend Rule 1!

 

IIRC, and I don't always so it is worth checking, the timetable changes that had Paddington-Bristol traffic extended to Weston Super Mare occurred at the time that the airconditioned ETH stock came into use, the idea being to release the platform quickly at Temple Meads on the down working and send the stock out of the way at a time when Malago Vale was busy, so D0280 would have been in South Wales by then.  I should know this, as it occurred during my time on the railway, but have forgotten in my dotage...

 

There are pictures of 1200 in blue at Bristol on Flickr dated 1970/71 at both Bristol and Paddington on passenger workings and I do remember the first time seeing the loco, and that was on Bath Road around the same time.  It was not ETH fitted but certainly dual braked and painted BR Blue when it was overhauled at Swindon after it's purchase from Brush in 1970, so it could be used with early non air conditioned Mk II stock.

[Phil Bullock]

Never dual braked folks - when train air brakes were fitted the vacuum brakes were removed

 

See http://www.class47.co.uk/c47_feature_424.php

 

Phil

[TravisM]

Never dual braked folks - when train air brakes were fitted the vacuum brakes were removed

 

See http://www.class47.co.uk/c47_feature_424.php

 

Phil

 

Hi Phil,

 

I was sure it went straight to air brakes and one of the first to become so but had a nagging doubt.  I believe there was some talk of having it ETH converted at the same time as it was air braked but space, time but namely money, kicked that idea into touch.

[TheSignalEngineer]

There is a picture of it passing Reading depot in 1971. Blue livery, 1st coach looks like Mk2 BFK, heading towards Paddington. Another around the same time shows it stabled at Ranleigh Bridge with the reporting number 1B02.

 

Correction for predictive text on my phone.

Edited February 16, 2018 by TheSignalEngineer

[stovepipe]

1200 Falcon was noted in blue livery on passenger services from Feb 1971 to August 1972, with 13.40 Weston SM - Padd worked on 26 July 1972. The headcodes I have noted in this period were 1A10, 1A32, 1B02, 1B09, 1B12, and 1B30.

 

There was an occasion on 3 Oct 1973, when it was seen at Gloucester with 1A32 headcode, so it may have worked the odd passenger train even after it's allocation to Ebbw Jct in late 1972. There was also the curious visit to Brush at Loughborough in June 1974, supposedly to act as a generator during power cuts.

[DY444]

As noted above it was never dual braked but it did work air braked Mk2s.  There are pictures around showing it hauling Mk2s on the WR after it was fitted with air brakes. 

[Clive Mortimore]

1200 Falcon was noted in blue livery on passenger services from Feb 1971 to August 1972, with 13.40 Weston SM - Padd worked on 26 July 1972. The headcodes I have noted in this period were 1A10, 1A32, 1B02, 1B09, 1B12, and 1B30.

 

There was an occasion on 3 Oct 1973, when it was seen at Gloucester with 1A32 headcode, so it may have worked the odd passenger train even after it's allocation to Ebbw Jct in late 1972. There was also the curious visit to Brush at Loughborough in June 1974, supposedly to act as a generator during power cuts.

The power cuts were in the winters of 72-73 and 73-74. As an apprentice with the CEGB I had to cross miners picket lines at the entrance to Brighton Power Station.

[TravisM]

If hauled early Mk II stock, does anyone know what the set consist was and I assume it would include a buffet/restaurant vehicle and a BG?

[Rugd1022]

At Taunton on Mk2 stock in May '71...

 

 

At Padd in 1971...

 

 

Undated shot at Horton Road with 1A32 up...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[TravisM]

At Taunton on Mk2 stock in May '71...

 

1200 FALCON at Taunton May 1971.jpg

 

At Padd in 1971...

 

1200 FALCON Paddington 1970s.jpg

 

Undated shot at Horton Road with 1A32 up...

 

BR WR 1200 FALCON Gloucester Horton Road.jpg

 

Love to know what the working was that took it to Taunton

[Rugd1022]

Possibly a test run out and back from either Swindon or Bristol.

[TheSignalEngineer]

There is a picture of it passing Reading depot in 1971. Blue livery, 1st coach looks like Mk2 BCK, heading towards Paddington. Another around the same time shows it stabled at Ranleigh Bridge with the reporting number 1B02.

A typical loco-hauled formation on a Bristol to Paddington train c1970/1 would have been  BFK,2xFK,FO,RB,4xSO,BG

[br2975]

A few observations......

.

D0280 went into Swindon, apparently for the fitting of dual AWS, and was repainted blue and given the number '0280' - I believe this was during December 1970.

.

It was about the time the loco was purchased by BR, and by the time it arrived back at Bath Road it was numbered 1200 having been taken into BR Capital Stock on 19/12/1970.

.

1200 didn't move to Ebbw Junction for another two and a half years, around August, 1972.

.

In its last years at Bristol, Bath Road, 'Falcon' was diagrammed for a summer dated, Saturdays only working from Bristol - Paignton, where the loco would lay over during the afternoon before working the balancing trip back to Bristol. Apparently this was not a popular diagram as only Bath Road men were trained on 'Falcon' and then only a few links.

.

From 12/10/1972 until May, 1973 'Falcon' was officially allocated to Canton, but still worked off Newport, Ebbw Junction where its regular role was to trip between Ebbw Junction, Alexandra Dock Junction, East Usk Junction and the Uskmouth Branch serving the power station, Lysaghts, Stewarts & Lloyds etc. This was a six-and a half day week job, when 'Falcon' was working.

 

During 1971-1972 some of the passenger diagrams referred to above were formed as follows;

.

1B02 06:05 Padd-Weston Super Mare formed BFK+FK+FK+FO (declassified)+RB+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO(FO)+BG.....air braked stock

1B02 11:45 Padd-Bristol formed BFK+FK+FK+FO+RB+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO+BSO.....air braked stock

1B12 07:45 Padd-Bristol formed BFK+FK+FK+FO (declassified)+RB+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO(FO)+BG.....air braked stock

.

When 'Falcon' was repaired at Gloucester (Horton Road) the one end displayed the reporting number 1A32 whilst the other displayed 1B46.

 

It would appear the movement of 'Falcon' to Brush, Loughborough in 1974 was the result of a mistake, when someone thought the loco was still their property.

 

Brian R

Edited February 16, 2018 by br2975

[TravisM]

 

During 1971-1972 some of the passenger diagrams referred to above were formed as follows;

.

1B02 06:05 Padd-Weston Super Mare formed BFK+FK+FK+FO (declassified)+RB+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO(FO)+BG.....air braked stock

1B02 11:45 Padd-Bristol formed BFK+FK+FK+FO+RB+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO+BSO.....air braked stock

1B12 07:45 Padd-Bristol formed BFK+FK+FK+FO (declassified)+RB+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO(FO)+BG.....air braked stock

 

 

Stupid question, would anyone know the coach numbers of these sets as I'd love to recreate a accurate set.

[stovepipe]

You might be able to trace a rake numbers from this one - Mk2a BFK W14073.

 

Brush Falcon 1200 BristolTM early 70s by MichaelCheetham, on Flickr

[stovepipe]

Here's another one Mk2b W13510

 

Falcon at Bath Spa 1970s by MichaelCheetham, on Flickr

[TravisM]

You might be able to trace a rake numbers from this one - Mk2a BFK W14073.

 

Brush Falcon 1200 BristolTM early 70s by MichaelCheetham, on Flickr

 

I tried looking on the Google site but I couldn't find any references.

[stovepipe]

Robert Carroll's Yahoo group has a few sightings from 1971. I think this is a Bristol working :

 

1A39 D1666, W5446 W5488 W5468 W14107 (all Mk2b) W13456 (Mk2a) W3013 W1754 (Mk1) W5344 (Mk2a) W5470 W5453 (Mk2b) W5357 (Mk2a) W81253 (Mk1)

 

14 July 1970 at Bristol

1B09 09.45 PADD D1032, W81245 W5496 W5461 W5337 W5469 W1737 W3015 W13455 W13452 W14106 W13451

1B13 13.45 PADD D1935, W81254 W5339 W5331 W5457 W5436 W1751 W3052 W13447 W13461 W14110

Edited February 16, 2018 by stovepipe

[Rugd1022]

A few observations......

.

D0280 went into Swindon, apparently for the fitting of dual AWS, and was repainted blue and given the number '0280' - I believe this was during December 1970.

.

It was about the time the loco was purchased by BR, and by the time it arrived back at Bath Road it was numbered 1200 having been taken into BR Capital Stock on 19/12/1970.

.

1200 didn't move to Ebbw Junction for another two and a half years, around August, 1972.

.

In its last years at Bristol, Bath Road, 'Falcon' was diagrammed for a summer dated, Saturdays only working from Bristol - Paignton, where the loco would lay over during the afternoon before working the balancing trip back to Bristol. Apparently this was not a popular diagram as only Bath Road men were trained on 'Falcon' and then only a few links.

.

From 12/10/1972 until May, 1973 'Falcon' was officially allocated to Canton, but still worked off Newport, Ebbw Junction where its regular role was to trip between Ebbw Junction, Alexandra Dock Junction, East Usk Junction and the Uskmouth Branch serving the power station, Lysaghts, Stewarts & Lloyds etc. This was a six-and a half day week job, when 'Falcon' was working.

 

During 1971-1972 some of the passenger diagrams referred to above were formed as follows;

.

1B02 06:05 Padd-Weston Super Mare formed BFK+FK+FK+FO (declassified)+RB+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO(FO)+BG.....air braked stock

1B02 11:45 Padd-Bristol formed BFK+FK+FK+FO+RB+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO+BSO.....air braked stock

1B12 07:45 Padd-Bristol formed BFK+FK+FK+FO (declassified)+RB+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO+TSO(FO)+BG.....air braked stock

.

When 'Falcon' was repaired at Gloucester (Horton Road) the one end displayed the reporting number 1A32 whilst the other displayed 1B46.

 

It would appear the movement of 'Falcon' to Brush, Loughborough in 1974 was the result of a mistake, when someone thought the loco was still their property.

 

Brian R

0280-Swindon Works-undated.jpg

 

Thanks for posting the pic of it at Swindon as '0280' Brian.... it was changed to 1200 before it left the works. There is at least one other colour photo of it like this somewhere, buggered if I can find it though!

Edited February 16, 2018 by Rugd1022

[TravisM]

Robert Carroll's Yahoo group has a few sightings from 1971. I think this is a Bristol working :

 

1A39 D1666, W5446 W5488 W5468 W14107 (all Mk2b) W13456 (Mk2a) W3013 W1754 (Mk1) W5344 (Mk2a) W5470 W5453 (Mk2b) W5357 (Mk2a) W81253 (Mk1)

 

14 July 1970 at Bristol

1B09 09.45 PADD D1032, W81245 W5496 W5461 W5337 W5469 W1737 W3015 W13455 W13452 W14106 W13451

1B13 13.45 PADD D1935, W81254 W5339 W5331 W5457 W5436 W1751 W3052 W13447 W13461 W14110

 

Thanks for that, I meant Yahoo not Google.  I think I will go for one of those as I don't think they would have changed much by the time the time Falcon arrived at Bath Road.

Edited February 16, 2018 by jools1959