peteskitchen Posted March 2, 2018 Share Posted March 2, 2018 As my knowledge of PO wagons is limited, I have to go by if it looks right, then its OK for me. But what really grates with Oxford Rail wagons is how far the couplings stick out. Bachmann seem to have there's set much closer yet they can happily manage to negotiate 2nd rad curves. Hell even Mainline wagons from the days of old were much closer coupling! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted March 2, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 2, 2018 At least they are NEM mounted, and presumably easily replaced with Bachmann ones. I can't say I'd particularly noticed this, but of course now you've pointed it out I will; not sure whether to thank you or not for that... I am of course assuming that the NEM mounts are positioned to specification, otherwise there is no point in replacing the couplers with shorter ones! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted March 2, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 2, 2018 Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear. Let's paint a Mark 1 carriage chocolate and cream and call it Great Western. I just cannot understand why wagons built to RCH 1907 standards are not available. They would surely overlap the RCH 1923 versions, by many years in some cases, and be eminently more suitable for pre-grouping use. Instead we have these 'faux' wagons, often not in accurate liveries, which many people run because they are 'pretty'! I understand that at nationalisation, there were more RCH 1907 PO wagons than 1923 ones. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted March 2, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 2, 2018 (edited) I understand that at nationalisation, there were more RCH 1907 PO wagons than 1923 ones. Quite possibly, but I doubt it stayed that way for long. The youngest would be 26 years old and such wagons didn't have an easy life. BR also targeted anything that couldn't carry 12/13 tons for early replacement, so the numbers of 10-tonners would have declined rapidly. AIUI, BR weeded out several thousand of the worst (mechanically) ex-PO wagons more-or-less on receipt and there were two further big clear-outs in 1950 and 1952 consequent to the arrival of steel-body 16-tonners in large quantities. The 1952 purge made inroads into 1923-pattern stock, too and older wagons would have become quite thin on the ground after that. Of course, many of the wagons BR no longer wanted, still had some life left in them and many ended up as internal-user-only with the NCB. John Edited March 2, 2018 by Dunsignalling Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted March 2, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 2, 2018 (edited) Quite possibly, but I doubt it stayed that way for long. Several thousand isn't that big a dent in half a million! It would be interesting to see a year-on-year plot of ex-PO wagon numbers vs. 16 tonners. On the other hand, during the grouping era, which is perhaps nearly as popular among modellers as the 1950s or 1960s, RCH 1907 wagons always outnumbered RCH 1923 wagons. One has to concede that, from a manufacturer's point of view, the fact that the 1907 specification still allowed for more variation in appearance of wagons from the various builders than did the 1923 specification, is a problem. Edited March 2, 2018 by Compound2632 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garethp8873 Posted May 8, 2018 Author Share Posted May 8, 2018 Found an update on Oxford Rail's page today: "3rd May 2018: Livery samples have arrived in our office which include the N7 and the 5 plank wagons. Photographs to follow soon" 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted May 9, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted May 9, 2018 (edited) Several thousand isn't that big a dent in half a million! It would be interesting to see a year-on-year plot of ex-PO wagon numbers vs. 16 tonners. On the other hand, during the grouping era, which is perhaps nearly as popular among modellers as the 1950s or 1960s, RCH 1907 wagons always outnumbered RCH 1923 wagons. One has to concede that, from a manufacturer's point of view, the fact that the 1907 specification still allowed for more variation in appearance of wagons from the various builders than did the 1923 specification, is a problem. The several thousand condemned immediately by BR would have been the roughest of the rough and many would have seen little use since the end of WW2 anyway. In the severe winter of 1947/8, I imagine such a source of firewood would have been most welcome. As a general rule of thumb, every two new 16-tonners did for three timber-built wagons, and 21/24.5-tonners, two each so the rate of attrition would have become quite rapid as production ramped up by the early 1950s. Hopper wagons were also being constructed in quite large numbers. There were eventually a quarter of a million 16-tonners to Diagram 108 alone, which would have accounted for around 375,000 older wagons, though that figure would include ex-company mineral wagons as well as private owners. Many old wagons in serviceable condition would have been sold for internal colliery use with the NCB rather than scrapped. I have (somewhere!) a small booklet of statistics issued by BR in which, IIRC, it states that around 50% of old coal/mineral wagons had been replaced by the end of 1952. John Edited May 9, 2018 by Dunsignalling 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cor-onGRT4 Posted May 10, 2018 Share Posted May 10, 2018 (edited) The several thousand condemned immediately by BR would have been the roughest of the rough and many would have seen little use since the end of WW2 anyway. In the severe winter of 1947/8, I imagine such a source of firewood would have been most welcome. As a general rule of thumb, every two new 16-tonners did for three timber-built wagons, and 21/24.5-tonners, two each so the rate of attrition would have become quite rapid as production ramped up by the early 1950s. Hopper wagons were also being constructed in quite large numbers. There were eventually a quarter of a million 16-tonners to Diagram 108 alone, which would have accounted for around 375,000 older wagons, though that figure would include ex-company mineral wagons as well as private owners. Many old wagons in serviceable condition would have been sold for internal colliery use with the NCB rather than scrapped. I have (somewhere!) a small booklet of statistics issued by BR in which, IIRC, it states that around 50% of old coal/mineral wagons had been replaced by the end of 1952. John Does this mean that the new Oxford 7 plank wagon in NCB liverie is postwar and as mentioned here is an example of the ones sold to NCB after the war, enyone knowes? Edited May 10, 2018 by Cor-onGRT4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted May 10, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 10, 2018 Does this mean that the new Oxford 7 plank wagon in NCB liverie is postwar and as mentioned here is an example of the ones sold to NCB after the war, enyone knowes? Evidently it must post-date the nationalisation of the coal industry in July 1946. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garethp8873 Posted May 30, 2018 Author Share Posted May 30, 2018 Wagon samples of the Oxford Rail 5 Plank wagons are now on Hattons and Rails of Sheffield Images owned by Hattons Oxford Rail OR76MW5001 5-plank open wagon "T.Bowler, London" Oxford Rail OR76MW5002 5-plank open wagon "Busbys, East Kensington" Oxford Rail OR76MW5003 5-plank open wagon "Coppice, Cannock" Oxford Rail OR76MW5004 5-plank open wagon "W.M. Barnard, Worcester" Oxford Rail OR76MW5005 5-plank open wagon "ICI Lime Limited, Buxton" 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted May 30, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 30, 2018 How come an RCH 1923 standard wagon carries a L&SW address? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Pteremy Posted May 30, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 30, 2018 On a positive note there do not appear to be any post nationalisation modifications of the sort that were present on the e.g. 7 plank minerals? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Marlin Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 How come an RCH 1923 standard wagon carries a L&SW address? Even more bemusingly, why is Hattons advertising a wagon as 'Busbys, East Kensington' when the wagon very clearly has West Kensington printed on the side? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted May 30, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted May 30, 2018 (edited) Also note different buffer guides on the Barnard wagon. There's a representation of the side knees but no other internal ironwork. But that's asking a lot of a RTR wagon. Edited May 30, 2018 by Compound2632 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penlan Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 How come an RCH 1923 standard wagon carries a L&SW address? Client ordered before the Grouping 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted May 30, 2018 Share Posted May 30, 2018 Client ordered before the Grouping Apparently anachronistic lettering like this was not uncommon. A quick look at one of the David Larkin albums produced 'Winnington (?) LMR, CLC' on a Soda-ash Hopvan, built in 1948, and 'Oakamoor NS Section' on a 24.5t Sand hopper. This latter was photographed in 1970, some 47 years after the Grouping, the wagon having been built in 1958. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Nile Posted September 10, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 10, 2018 Now in stock at Hatton's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted September 10, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted September 10, 2018 'NS Section' is an example of why this could. and did happen; the location was still identified on the railway and addressed in railway terms by reference to the pre grouping company's address. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Saunders Posted September 10, 2018 Share Posted September 10, 2018 'NS Section' is an example of why this could. and did happen; the location was still identified on the railway and addressed in railway terms by reference to the pre grouping company's address. Many parts of the railway are still identified by their pregroping owner and likewise by original owner of sidings Glagow and South Western for an entire line Out of Leeds towards Stouron the Midland only acquiring the name on resignalling so as the were not two Normanton Lines on the same signal box From Manchester to Liverpool via Irlam the Cheshire lines Shell junction on Teesside and the refinery closed in the 1980's The list could fill a book Mark Saunders Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Nile Posted September 15, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 15, 2018 Bought one today to play with. Here is what I found. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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