Help please new modern image layout.

[beast66606]

Folks need your thoughts please on my Yard/industry to the right of my layout. I have found Northenden Cement terminal and thought it would make a good subject. ..?

 

I have nearly finished the main baseboards and should make a start on the fiddle yards this weekend with an eye to start laying track next week

 

Northenden would make a cracking layout - you have chosen wisely !

[imt]

Folks need your thoughts please on my Yard/industry to the right of my layout. I have found Northenden Cement terminal and thought it would make a good subject. ..?

 

I have nearly finished the main baseboards and should make a start on the fiddle yards this weekend with an eye to start laying track next week

 Note also less tracks!  It would be a good idea.  Sand, gravel, limestone trains in, bulk cement out - including some for your engineering depot.

[stevie_ruc]

Are those MBA wagons behind the 66?

Edited December 2, 2017 by stevie_ruc

[stevie_ruc]

So I have priced up the signals

 

Absolute aspects. £1150

Cr signals £560

 

Wow. Think I’ll be scouting EBay !!!

[JDW]

So I have priced up the signals

 

Absolute aspects. £1150

Cr signals £560

 

Wow. Think I’ll be scouting EBay !!!

 

Ouch!  

 

http://www.knightwing.co.uk/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?cart_id=&product=OO-HO_Building_Kits&pid=182 - Less than £10/pack, don't cost anything in electricity,  and imagining the colours comes free too (this latter feature also makes it impossible to pass one at red) 

 

And yes, I think they are MBAs - http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/52238-Bachmann-38-240-megabox-mba/?p=633411

[royaloak]

Will send a pm when I get home with a rough summery

 

In short each signal has a long stop grid next to it. While they also need I think 2 of the speed sensor grids in advance of the signal. That can be compressed in model form (iirc they are fairly far away) I think I went for 2ft.

Not all signals will be TPWS fitted, basic rule is only signals which protect conflicting moves will be fitted, there are exceptions where some which protect conflicting moves wont be fitted and some which dont protect conflicting moves will be fitted.

[imt]

So I have priced up the signals

 

Absolute aspects. £1150

Cr signals £560

 

Wow. Think I’ll be scouting EBay !!!

 

And sadly you have forgotten the additional (approximately) £20 per signal for the DCC decoder/control connections!  As I said a long time back on this thread - signalling (real life and in model form) is expensive which is why not every route that might be used is signalled.  The beautiful signal plan you have covers it all. Expensive though isn't it!  Which is why I used Traintech signals in the end and kissed goodbye to PLS and RIs on those that needed them.

Edited December 8, 2017 by imt

[big jim]

only had a brief flick through the first 2 pages, interesting plan so far

 

ref simons signals in the depot, wembley chiltern has them on every road

 

'coming off the fuel line onto the mainline', the north end of bescot is like that, you either go into the shunt neck, (1 and a bit locos long) or out onto the mainline to change ends after fuelling to get back into the yard or goods line, either option stuffs up the goods or main while the shunt happens

[beast66606]

Are those MBA wagons behind the 66?0741B1E0-D7D9-4690-A482-4C3F15F37494.png

 

Not MBAs.

 

Where and when was the photo taken ?

[5BarVT]

Yes, I'm not sure on the double slip numbering, I couldn't find a nice example of numbering quickly, so I just went by Paul's numbering in post #47, which was slightly confusing!

I can be: just ‘cos I know what mean doesn’t mean everyone else will!

Apologies for being absent while discussions proceeded. What is shown on Simon’s v3 isn’t quite what I meant. Think of a peco double slip - the four switch rails at each end of the slip move together so one end will have one number and the other end a separate number (either of which may be shared with another point end if it forms part of a crossover). Simon now has access to an example through the professional route.

Paul.

[5BarVT]

So I have priced up the signals

Absolute aspects. £1150

Cr signals £560

Wow. Think I’ll be scouting EBay !!!

Stevie,

As others have said, as client you are discovering that signals are expensive! :-0

So having discovered that what you thought you might like is more than you can afford let’s see what we can do to help.

First: you said a long way back that you wanted modern liveries - a layout with modern trains soesnt have to have modern signalling (can do but doesn’t have to). Oxford until very recently is/was early ‘70s signalling. I can remove some signals that way.

Second: not all signals have to be visible, just pretend that they are off scene or hidden.

Third: by defining the operating methods, some signals can be replaced with stop boards.

Fourth: all spread out on Simon’s plan the signals look OK (plan is fine from that respect), but your layout has much shorter distances in some places so a reduction of signals will actually look better.

And last: start small and add as finance permits - there are legitimate intermediate states that will be perfectly prototypical.

 

Let’s start with the depot: you don’t need any of the OD signals. I know you said a Depot system would be nice - as an intermediate stage you could just have the ‘indicators’ protecting the shed doors (OD 6/8/10/12). All the Depot points would be hand points and to prevent accidents to the tanks on the spur you could say that the point allowing access is locked with a point clip except when tanks are put in there or removed. A ‘STOP Await Instructions’ Board at the toes of the fuel road points is all the signalling needed.

 

OE102 could be assumed to be off scene in the fiddle yard. OE118 can be hidden round the corner and in the tunnel. Probably a bit of a push to say OE120/2 would be hidden, but careful extension of view blockers could achieve that.

 

OE105 can be moved back to where OE201 is then sports a sub signal to go into the Depot. (OE200 remains for Depot exit). Make Goods Loop 2 a siding and 309 hand points, make OE113/5 stop boards and put a shunt signal on the toes of 308A (3 route indications, but they don’t have to be working). That removes the indicator from OE204 and the PLJI and route indicator from OE108. OE107 does not need a PLJI as there is only one route from the signal (to DM) and trains are starting from rest. OE122 becomes a shunt signal.

 

 

There is an even more minimalist solution but I don’t think that is what you want. Make all the sidings hand points and provide shunt signals at 302A, opposite 306B, 306A, and clear of 311 points (with one of the traps moved to be 311B).

 

Price that up and see if you like the cost savings! And it will still be prototypical.

 

Critical comments from the client, the designer, and other observers awaited! ;-)

Paul.

[The Stationmaster]

If you assume it is 1970s Northern England but not LM Region resignalling you can get rid of any route indicators on ground position lights as well.

[imt]

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Try here for symbols (its a bit old, but its still fairly right): http://rdt.ergotools.co.uk/Content/Documents/signalscheme-legend.pdf 

 

.....

 

The link doesn't work (for me anyway) but you can get there using http://rdt.ergotools.co.uk/Pages/UserGuide/SignallingCharts.aspx and clicking on the link there.