GWR goods brake vans page on gwr.org

[rprodgers]

During lockdown I thought I’d build/ see what I could do with a bag of bits which was a part built PECO Toad brake van. It fell of a shelf ages ago  whilst awaiting painting and the foot boards and many other parts parted company - the bits were bagged up and left.

sticking the parts together/repairing can someone confirm that the doors on this kit should be “stepped” back from the main body sides rather than in line ?

Even like this the doors still appear to be too wide and without filing would need to be angled and shown slightly ajar.

[88D]

8 hours ago, mike morley said:

At about the same time as I was using Klear to stick down the ballast on the layout I was building a few years ago, someone on an earlier incarnation of RMweb was revealing that Klear could also be used to glaze cab windows.

As a friend of mine remarked incredulously, "Is there anything that stuff can't do?"

I’ve  used it on my kitchen floor, and it worked on that as well. Is there anything that the stuff can’t do?

[MrWolf]

1 hour ago, 88D said:

I’ve  used it on my kitchen floor, and it worked on that as well. Is there anything that the stuff can’t do?

That's all I have ever used it for. I put all the old red and blue chequer board flags back into the kitchen of my first house and sealed them with Johnson Klear. It was amusing watching the dog trying to gain traction on that floor if someone came to the door.

Dobermans' are not fitted with sanding gear and it's probably not advisable to try retro fitting it either!

[corneliuslundie]

It sounds as though some Johnson's Klear should go on the shopping list as soon as a suitable shop reopens.

I am not familiar with the Peco Toad,. What Diagram is it?

Jonathan

[John Isherwood]

54 minutes ago, corneliuslundie said:

It sounds as though some Johnson's Klear should go on the shopping list as soon as a suitable shop reopens.

I am not familiar with the Peco Toad,. What Diagram is it?

Jonathan

 

Before you go shopping for Klear, do a bit of Googling on the subject.

 

Johnsons seem to like rebranding and reformulating it; (I bulk-bought the original); but received wisdom is that the current formulation works as well as the original.

 

John Isherwood.

[mike morley]

There are some things the current version does as well as always and other things it doesnt.  One of the problems is, though, that they are bringing out new formulations so frequently that whatever you Google could be the version before last and the one on the shelf in the supermarket a version that might not evenhave been mentioned on Google yet.

 

A few years ago there was a thread on here that evolved into an attempt to keep track of which version was best suited to what (it was there that I found out about its ability to secure ballast and glaze windows) but the thread soon broke down and was abandoned because Klear evolved so rapidly it became impossible to keep track of the various versions or identify which version you'd got.  In the end, you just have to by a bottle and see what it'll do, secure in the knowledge that it will do more than you would ever expect!

[rprodgers]

5 hours ago, corneliuslundie said:

It sounds as though some Johnson's Klear should go on the shopping list as soon as a suitable shop reopens.

I am not familiar with the Peco Toad,. What Diagram is it?

Jonathan

Jonathan it’s the old PECO 7mm plastic kit of I believe diagram AA3

 

Paul

[corneliuslundie]

If you mean the doors into the veranda, see the photo of an AA3 van here. They are a bit recessed.

http://www.gwr.org.uk/nobrakes.html

There may also be more detail on other bits than you wanted to know!

Jonathan

[Steamport Southport]

They do AA1. AA3 and AA6. They are the old Webster Models O Gauge range. 

 

AA1 6 wheel 24T

AA3 16T

AA6 Permanent Way enclosed balcony.

 

https://peco-uk.com/products/great-western-railway-16ton-toad-brake-van

 

 

 

Jason

[gwrrob]

On the brake allocations page of gwr.org on the list they have several at Severn Tunnel and branded so but I can't find a photo. Can anyone help please ? I'm assuming they dropped the Junction branding from them at sometime.

[Miss Prism]

The bible's plate 652 is an AA15 pictured in 1919 with 'Severn Tunnel Junc' marking (certainly not enough room for 'Junction'), whereas plate 641 is an AA4 pictured in 1922 with the simpler 'Severn Tunnel' marking.

 

 

 

 

[88D]

On 19/04/2020 at 12:15, cctransuk said:

 

Before you go shopping for Klear, do a bit of Googling on the subject.

 

Johnsons seem to like rebranding and reformulating it; (I bulk-bought the original); but received wisdom is that the current formulation works as well as the original.

 

John Isherwood.

I think it is now called Pledge. Seems confusing because they say it is a wax, but I think this stems from the American market. I guess other manufacturers’ products can do the job as well, it’s just that we’re fairly safe and conservative in pledging our loyalty to Klear. Pun there.

[rprodgers]

20 hours ago, corneliuslundie said:

If you mean the doors into the veranda, see the photo of an AA3 van here. They are a bit recessed.

http://www.gwr.org.uk/nobrakes.html

There may also be more detail on other bits than you wanted to know!

Jonathan

 

Yes the doors into the veranda. In the link a 7mm Peco 6 whl AA1 56972 is shown with the door ajar (at an angle) ...this seems to be like mine the door don't fit - are too wide.

So I will get the file out and narrow the doors so they fit.

 

 

The AA3 17539 (Crewe) shows the door closed and recessed inline with the bodywork of the brakevan

 

I cant imagine that if a Toad was underway the door would be left open to flap around causing a danger to the occupants and the hinges

[Steamport Southport]

1 hour ago, 88D said:

I think it is now called Pledge. Seems confusing because they say it is a wax, but I think this stems from the American market. I guess other manufacturers’ products can do the job as well, it’s just that we’re fairly safe and conservative in pledging our loyalty to Klear. Pun there.

 

It was always sold as floor polish. Places to try are Home & Bargain and B&M.

 

Humbrol also make their own version. Handy if you just want a bit. Not if you need a lot of it.

 

https://www.humbrol.com/uk-en/humbrol-gloss-clear-125ml-bottle.html

 

 

Jason

[Penrhos1920]

I’ve just tried some Klear on some Powsides transfers and it nearly turned to total disaster.  The Klear dissolved the transfers and turned them to milk.  Fortunately I was being cautious and caught it in time.

[John Isherwood]

2 hours ago, Penrhos1920 said:

I’ve just tried some Klear on some Powsides transfers and it nearly turned to total disaster.  The Klear dissolved the transfers and turned them to milk.  Fortunately I was being cautious and caught it in time.

 

It would seem that this propensity to dissolve in varnish is a feature of Powside transfers ink, and not attributable to any particular varnish.

 

Clearly, the next step is to enquire of Powsides as to which, if any, varnishes are safe to use over their transfers.

 

John Isherwood.

[corneliuslundie]

Thanks for the comments. A coat of Micro Flat seems to have done the trick with the white steaks on the brake van..

Jonathan

[The Johnster]

On 20/04/2020 at 14:22, rprodgers said:

 

Yes the doors into the veranda. In the link a 7mm Peco 6 whl AA1 56972 is shown with the door ajar (at an angle) ...this seems to be like mine the door don't fit - are too wide.

So I will get the file out and narrow the doors so they fit.

 

 

The AA3 17539 (Crewe) shows the door closed and recessed inline with the bodywork of the brakevan

 

I cant imagine that if a Toad was underway the door would be left open to flap around causing a danger to the occupants and the hinges

There was a hook that it could be held back with if you wanted it left open, which you usually did on warm days if the veranda end was trailing.

[tomparryharry]

12 hours ago, The Johnster said:

There was a hook that it could be held back with if you wanted it left open, which you usually did on warm days if the veranda end was trailing.

 

Sorry John, but I've never seen a hook on the verandah. My van never had one on any side. They do have hooks on the walls to pin the end windows open however. If the hinge pins on the verandah door wear out (and they do) then the door will sag, and you'll end up kicking the door shut. I've got 2 doors to make here, but that won't happen for quite a while yet.

[NCB]

The Peco site linked above has the interesting statement Unlike other companies' brake vans, the GWR's unique single verandah design meant that they had to be turned on a turntable before the return journey. Surely this is wrong?

[Steamport Southport]

6 minutes ago, NCB said:

The Peco site linked above has the interesting statement Unlike other companies' brake vans, the GWR's unique single verandah design meant that they had to be turned on a turntable before the return journey. Surely this is wrong?

 

It's been discussed before.

 

That's what the door at the end was for. So the guard can change the lamps and keep an eye out. Also an emergency exit if needs be.

 

 

 

However in the early days when most lines would have had turntables at the terminus they probably would get turned. Most small terminuses lost their turntables when they designed locomotives which worked well in reverse though. So unless there was a need to have them turned for operational reasons they didn't bother.

 

 

 

Jason

[bécasse]

I suspect that vans used on longer distance main line services were turned as, if they weren't, photos showing them wrong-way-round would be much more common (even though many such services ran at night).

[Steamport Southport]

3 minutes ago, bécasse said:

I suspect that vans used on longer distance main line services were turned as, if they weren't, photos showing them wrong-way-round would be much more common (even though many such services ran at night).

 

More likely just grab one that was facing the "right" way.

 

 

Jason

[NCB]

Question is, what would be the "right" way? If there was one I suppose it would be verandah at the end away from the train. But I can remember goods trains going through Stroud in the late 1950s with the verandah at the train end. There were loads of branches without turntables. If there was a "right" way, wouldn't the GWR have gone for double-ended vans? Save an awful lot of hassle.

Nigel

[Steamport Southport]

On 26/04/2020 at 20:10, NCB said:

Question is, what would be the "right" way? If there was one I suppose it would be verandah at the end away from the train. But I can remember goods trains going through Stroud in the late 1950s with the verandah at the train end. There were loads of branches without turntables. If there was a "right" way, wouldn't the GWR have gone for double-ended vans? Save an awful lot of hassle.

Nigel

 

I think all GWR branch lines had turntables, usually but not always near the engine shed. They removed most of them about the turn of the 20th century.

 

Some kept them such as Princetown.

 

 

Jason

Edited April 28, 2020 by Steamport Southport