When TT3 was the next Big Thing

[Golden Fleece 30]

Good deal I hope on the wheels - saw a pile like this at Doncaster works once ! 

Robert

TT or 12" scale Robert?

 

Hopefully I can fit them into Tri-ang stock with very little movement on one wheel.  Test soon when I have got the tender for the J39 modified and working.

 

Garry

Edited September 26, 2018 by Golden Fleece 30

[Golden Fleece 30]

The J39 is coming along and running quite nicely.  It is now ready for painting if I can get some primer tomorrow.  There are quite a few discrepancies  or inaccuracies which a scratchbuilder would not make (I hope).  The loco body has very small splashers which do not have a recess in for the wheels but I had to grind some in just for the flange, even with this the body seemed a little high to mount the buffers so I had to make a new buffer beam.  The real loco had 5'2" wheels which equtes to just over 15mm but the Jinty ones are 13.8 so scale wheels will lift it even higher. The body itself had a lot of ridges which I guess are from 3D printing.  The tender is an Atlas one as I have no idea when the chap who does the bodies will do the tenders.  This is the V2 one and is a bit wider than the J39 cab but no idea which is correct.  The A1A bogie had its sides filed down so I could glue the Atlas frames on, these are a little low due to 1) seeing to much of the bogie from at the bottom, and 2) I needed to glue some spacers on to get the tender buffer height correct. I did have to remove quite a bit of the coal load to be able to use the securing nut so later it will be as if just from the coaling tower, all stacked up. A couple of photos show why the Jinty chassis itself will not fit.  It is a Tri-ang style job so a lot of compromising is allowed.

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

Sods law, went out to get some primer then back home and went outside to do some spraying and guess what, no black :-(

 

Hopefully I might get some tonight when I take the little one swimming then can spray black and transfer tonight.

 

Here she is in "works grey".

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

The J 39 should hopefully be finished by tomorrow as it only requires numbers and crests putting on.

 

In the meantime here is a start on a BR A5 tank.  Again it is a 3D printed body and again it may want new buffer beams but the chassis, after cutting down, seems to fit nicely with the front bogie lining up with the buffer beam as it should, and, a Priarie pony truck lines up nicely at the rear using the original mounting hole which both save drilling and tapping new holes.

 

A bit of cutting of the loco body was needed to allow the motor to fit in the cab area though.

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

Here she is finished as 64747, the last J39 to be scrapped on 31st December 1964 although withdrawn in 1962.

 

I am still not keen on the tender underframe but it will have to do.

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

A video of the J39 in action. Really pleased with it.

 

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

Weather permitting the A5 should be painted tomorrow.  It now runs on its chassis.  To get the motor to fit I had to saw and file the rear part of the top pole piece and cut away the rear spectacle plate. The easy option for covering this is going to be a false coal load I think.  Like the J39 I had to make new buffer beams to get the buffers low enough to be the correct height, the buffers are from an A1A (that lost its power unit to the J39).  I did find out today how brittle these 3D models are but thankfully it was only part of the front buffer beam that snapped off.  I may glue plasticard "overlays" around the insides of the bunker and tanks later which might stop a full break if anything untoward does happen.

 

The bogie wheels will be replaced with metal ones and the Boxpoks will receive spoked overlays. The stains on this chassis were from a lot of filler used in the body for weight (not me it was an Ebay buy), so much and so tight I had to break the body up into small pieces to remove it and the filler was also wedged into the motor stopping it working but after stripping and cleaning it all it runs sweetly.

 

I don't recall seeing any in York but must have done as one is behind the A3 in 1960 so well in my spotting time in York yards, mine will get the number of 69803 as seen on the waterworks crossings at York station North end.

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

Here is 69803 bodywork finished, already gathering dust. The chassis needs to be painted but that can wait until I get some more wheel overlays made.

 

Garry

Edited October 3, 2018 by Golden Fleece 30

[Golden Fleece 30]

Someone on another Forum asked to see if I could photograph my locos in one.  That would be impossible so i have taken a few of similar classes so apologies for odd ones already seen on here.

 

There are 5 more M/N's 4 of which are still in the "works" under restoration.

There are 2 more Britannia's one of which has not arrived yet, it is in another nice collection. A couple are quite rough so one maybe used with another 9F chassis to make Evening Star.

Some DMU's have had the bogies robbed for diesels but at least 5 sets are runners. The ones that don't have a motor can be coupled to other units at times when fitted with a trailing bogie.

The 0-6-0 tender locos are 3 x J11's, 2 x 4F's and a 22xx. The unmade 22xx will be done in BR green one day.

 

The boxed Tri-ang items are from the bargain of the year collection, last year, each item costing only £6.00 making the Britannia £12 and DMU £18.00

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

You learn something everyday.

 

I did not know that in the late 50's Eames made a 57xx casting to fit the Jinty chassis, loco nearest camera.  This differed from the 60's Gem one having a straight skirt with splashers on and a flat top boiler tank top. The Gem skirt was slightly tapered from front to rear and the top had a slight ridge for the boiler, middle loco.  The far Pannier looks to be a modified K's 97xx cut down and possibly used with other parts.

 

Garry 

Edited October 5, 2018 by Golden Fleece 30

[kevinlms]

A quick question.

 

When was the terminology changed from TT3 to just TT?

 

I see from the Tri-ang boxes in the photos that they were labelled as TT Gauge and NOT TT3.

[Golden Fleece 30]

A quick question.

 

When was the terminology changed from TT3 to just TT?

 

I see from the Tri-ang boxes in the photos that they were labelled as TT Gauge and NOT TT3.

I believe it was Peco who added the 3 when they introduced the wagons, late 50's early 60's. I think it was also to do with Tri-ang being slightly larger scale wise at 1:100 as opposed to 1:120. Not 100% sure on these but someone else might be able to clarify.

 

Garry

Edited October 7, 2018 by Golden Fleece 30

[Il Grifone]

A quick question.

 

When was the terminology changed from TT3 to just TT?

 

I see from the Tri-ang boxes in the photos that they were labelled as TT Gauge and NOT TT3.

 

Tri-ang was always just 'TT'. The term TT3 was coined (by the 'Railway Modeller' IIRC) to distinguish between 3mm to the foot and 1/120 scales  (TT25). Where there is no confusion the term TT is quite sufficient. The gauge is 12mm in both cases, but we are back back to the old problem of getting the 'works' into the restricted British loading gauge. (it's a problem in full size....)

Edited October 7, 2018 by Il Grifone

[kevinlms]

I believe it was Peco who added the 3 when they introduced the wagons, late 50's early 60's. I think it was also to do with Tri-ang being slightly larger scale wise at 1:100 as opposed to 1:120. Not 100% sure on these but someone else might be able to clarify.

 

Garry

I suspect it was a Peco/Railway Modeller thing. So when did they stop using TT3?

 

Just looking at Railway Modeller for 1959 March - which is a special edition, marking 2 years since TT was introduced. There is also a chart on page 58 listing the standards for 'TM' which has a track gauge of 13.5mm. This is the equivalent of 4mm scale EM.

 

Edit to add.

 

I assume that TM stands for Thirteen Millimetre, the same way EM stands for Eighteen Millimetre.

Edited October 7, 2018 by kevinlms

[Golden Fleece 30]

I suspect it was a Peco/Railway Modeller thing. So when did they stop using TT3?

 

Just looking at Railway Modeller for 1959 March - which is a special edition, marking 2 years since TT was introduced. There is also a chart on page 58 listing the standards for 'TM' which has a track gauge of 13.5mm. This is the equivalent of 4mm scale EM.

Kitmaster also used the term TT3 but it was never adopted by Tri-ang. Since David mentioned the RM link I remember reading that too now.

 

As far as I know other manufacturers never added the 3 until the 3mm society started although it was a prefix not a suffix then, and one supplier is called 3smr. Some may have stated on a box TT 3mm scale but not TT3 as such.

 

Tri-ang stopped production of TT around 1964/5 time and the catalogues from then on until 1968, when it was removed altogether from Tri-ang, just got thinner and would start to say Not available on items cleared from the shelves.

 

Garry

Edited October 7, 2018 by Golden Fleece 30

[Golden Fleece 30]

What I had not realised is that Tri-ang TT development was started in 1954 and took 3 years to reach production in 1957.

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

My little 1960/2 York based J72 as how I saw her in the good old days. The Peter Brumby/53A models photo shows her like this in 1960.

 

I could not get the green shade that was in the photo but mixed what was the best I could do.  There are various comments about the NER colour and I do not want to get involved in suffice to say none were what is depicted in the photo.

 

I am very disappointed in the Fox lining as the corners and straight lines are different in the widths of the white. As usual the transfers are 00 though and a little oversize.

 

Overall a nice shunter for my "York" based layouts.

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

A short video of the A5 on test.

 

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

The J72 having a run.

 

 

Garry

[Robert Shrives]

Lovely runners !  I like the way you have a garden picnic table just the right size ..

 

Robert  

[Golden Fleece 30]

Lovely runners !  I like the way you have a garden picnic table just the right size ..

 

Robert  

That picnic table was the left over decking planks when we built the decked area and it just made up into a good sized table for the kids when they come down, that was before I started with the TT again.  TT does stand for Table Top though.

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

My first Gem Royal Scot having its first run. Note the wheels were painted in red by its previous owner but will be blacked later. I need to either modify the front bogie to go around Tri-ang curves or use a larger radius layout, I never thought to try it out before painting etc.

 

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

Certainly not the easiest of kits to put together these 3mm society ones. One of the major issues I have found is that the tabs are often too thick to fit the slots which I guess is from "scaling" down a 4mm model without any allowance made for material thickness being different but not scaled the same. The thickness of some parts is like tissue paper, maybe thinner. The B1 kit I have is similar.  The boiler and smokebox came already put together so I have been doing the rest. Unfortunately the tender sides, firebox, all whitemetal fittings for the loco are missing, and no instructions to say if anything else is either. I have been told that some parts have been found that MAY belong to this loco and on there way to me, fingers crossed otherwise I will be having to make new ones :-(.

 

This could take a while to be a runner.

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

All is not what it seems. The chassis is very difficult to assemble. Not one spacer or cylinder ends fit. You can see from one photo how the etch has been done from both sides and does not match up leaving a ridge on every piece and hole. Where the slots are for the spacer tabs it cannot be cleaned out and filing the thickness on the tabs down was not enough. To fit the cylinder ends I had to run a hacksaw down the slots in them and the frames. I have soldered these in along with the rear spacer which fits in a recess not a slot so I could file it. Even the axle holes had this issue and could therefore not be square. Later I will find some nickel strip to push through the slots to solder then make some solid blocks to fit between the frames. Also with the front end square it looks as if it runs out to the back slightly but I will check later with a few rods in place.  Might have to look at doing my own later even if kits are available.

 

The frame spacer slots look to be thinner than the base material to start with before the issue of undercut ridges.

 

Garry

[Golden Fleece 30]

This little lot has just arrived.  The Brit is quite good but I may be using it for other things.  The King has the better open spoked wheels and will be done in BR green and I might make a proper copper chimney for it like my blue one.  There is an old Kitmaster Royal Scot motorised with another open spoked chassis which is a first for me.  I do have an unmade one to do one day and this gives me an idea what to do but another different class of loco for a change, it will need stripping and the moulded lining edges removing though.

 

The coaches are not up to much but I will use their bogies for some Gresley and Mk1 parcels kits.  I know not the correct pattern for the Gresley's but easy to rewheel and use. I can always say they had replacement bogie fitted at the last overhaul :-)

 

Garry

Edited October 12, 2018 by Golden Fleece 30