Jub45565 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 Hi We have had one since July last year and it hasn't changed our bills at all. You won't have a choice come 2020. Cheers Paul Correct, it wont have changed. The poont is that the suppliers could change the way they charge now they have a way of getting more detailed stats from you. For the record, I have them too. If the time comes when I need to alter useage for a balance betwen whem I want things & ecomony, I will do so. If anyone is bored enough to hack into my energy meter, feel free. I think the Chinese governments have bigger fish to fry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium QWILPEN Posted April 12, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 12, 2017 According to someone interviewed on a consumer programme the other day it will be better to wait - there is a second generation smart meter on the way that will work better - the ones fitted so far will need a software upgrade in a year or two to make them compatible with the revised standard. John Johns right the next generation of smart meters known as smets2 will be available later this year if you want a smart meter wait until these are available. thats what i'm doing ( i work for one of the big 6). Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium QWILPEN Posted April 12, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 12, 2017 Sim card, well, that will be interesting as most mobile 'phones don't work in my house, they work across the street, but not in my location. Sim card is only one of the available comms methods but the most likley used as its cheap? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
APOLLO Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 Not the Chinese you have to worry about. Some geek hacking in shutting off millions of the damn things - no manual override - computer chip says no therefore no gas / electricity. Maybe overblown a bit but a possibility. I'll stick with my old meters though I change suppliers now and again. (no company loyalty !!) Brit15 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
asmay2002 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 (edited) If anyone is bored enough to hack into my energy meter, feel free. I think the Chinese governments have bigger fish to fry. Chinese Govt has nothing to do with it. The whole "Internet of Things" idea is a massive security problem for everybody. See for example https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/15-million-connected-cameras-ddos-botnet-brian-krebs for the way internet connected dumb devices are already being used to create botnets for cyber crime. Edited April 12, 2017 by asmay2002 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PaulCheffus Posted April 12, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 12, 2017 Not the Chinese you have to worry about. Some geek hacking in shutting off millions of the damn things - no manual override - computer chip says no therefore no gas / electricity. Maybe overblown a bit but a possibility. I'll stick with my old meters though I change suppliers now and again. (no company loyalty !!) Brit15 Hi It's not just smart meters you need to worry about in this respect. Do you have a smart TV? If so they are just as vulnerable. Cheers Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewartingram Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 Well for a start you will have a device controlling the power in your house that is suceptible to computer viruses in a way that a simple mechanical meter simply isn't. There is no way imaginable that that is a good thing. During the enforced power cuts of the 70s, and 3 day working weeks, a large number of the meters on our estate failed - many of them actually running backwards. Stewart Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Tony_S Posted April 12, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 12, 2017 Forgot to mention that we are on a Night Rate/Day Rate meter, so would that make a difference? There are only two of us here, so our energy usage isn't terribly high. We have found the water meter to be a good thing, so I wonder if more people in the home skews opinions for and against? I initially welcomed the idea, as I mentioned in the original post we have had so many arguments with our present supplier over disputed energy usage, we can't enter meter readings online, as we did with our old supplier, and any 'phone call means a long, long wait listening to horrible, distorted music as "we are experiencing a high volume of calls at the moment", that's why I'm interested in examples of why I should look the gift horse in the mouth. Two of us here most of the time. We had no choice about having a water meter as our house was built in the community charge (poll tax) era so didn't have a rateable value. Neighbours with slightly older but essentially identical houses pay a lot more than we do for the water. Our electricity was on a day night tariff and we had gas from the same supplier. The electricity meter clock was quite inaccurate and we needed a replacement meter. We were offered smart electricity and gas meters. We were told there woukd be no problem with the electricity meter but the gas meter was subject to some checks on installation day. I was concerned about how the gas meter would transmit a signal if there was no electrical supply near the gas meter. However it has a battery and it "phones home" when it needs replacing about every 2 years it would seem. We have had no problems with installation, use or billing. Our supplier is EON. Hope this helps. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 40-something Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 Johns right the next generation of smart meters known as smets2 will be available later this year if you want a smart meter wait until these are available. thats what i'm doing ( i work for one of the big 6). Steve Seconded, I work for one of the Big 6 too and we are starting to roll out the SMETS2 meters. I had smart meters booked to be fitted to my property but the gas and leccy meters couldnt talk to each other (lec at the front, gas at the back) so they left the old ones in! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
APOLLO Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 Brit15 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyA Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 Last November they insisted on fitting one for the electricity in spite of me telling them that the signal here was bad. They fitted it and it is still not working! The engineer said that they may have to fit an external aerial. No thank you! Meanwhile, I still read the meter myself and enter it online. Tony 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ess1uk Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 Think I will hold on till the end and wait. Got a letter this week saying to ring to make an appointment to get one fitted. Not keen on the idea Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
vitalspark Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 Hi We have had one since July last year and it hasn't changed our bills at all. You won't have a choice come 2020. Cheers Paul Yes you do! The government want all homes fitted with smart meters by 2020..but thats to satisfy their commitment to the customers..the final choice is yours as they can't force you to have one. Its likely they will eventuality use the line that conventional meters are no longer available but if you are insisting that you don't want a device that 'talks' to a third party then they are obliged to fit one with a disabled Sim. There are many customers out there who are happy enough with the system as it is plus they may not want a third party knowing when their house is occupied and the pattern of their movements. Also if there any billing mistakes made by your supplier which result in you being underbilled they can simply adjust the tariff remotely to display a higher unit rate and claw back their mistakes quickly. You will certainly be losing control over things and lets face it the power companies make plenty of mistakes so until I am satisfied that there is an advantage in having one I will stick with a conventional meter. These things may offer you some extra features and help you to understand your daily usage but there are devices on the market right now that do that without communicating your every move to others. Also once nearly every home has one and thats millions..I would be surprised if we didn't see a degree of malicious hacking as we experience now with random PCs being targeted. I have been over 30 years in the industry and I can assure you the main advantage and cost savings are to the power companies. Dave. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 Chinese Govt has nothing to do with it. The whole "Internet of Things" idea is a massive security problem for everybody. See for example https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/15-million-connected-cameras-ddos-botnet-brian-krebs for the way internet connected dumb devices are already being used to create botnets for cyber crime. It's a problem where poor half-baked implementations are tacked on to a product when the manufacturer doesn't really understand software. Hence: The remotely exploitable Aga! http://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/04/13/aga_oven_iot_insecurity/ Oh no! My dishwasher's web server has a directory traversal vulnerability! https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/03/26/miele_joins_internetofst_hall_of_shame/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold BoD Posted April 13, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 13, 2017 Slightly OT but I find it annoying that one minute their adverts are telling you that the meters are free and the next minute they are citing the cost of having to fit meters as contributing to recent price rises, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free At Last Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 Think I will hold on till the end and wait. Got a letter this week saying to ring to make an appointment to get one fitted. Not keen on the idea I rang back and said I don't want one, they were fine about it. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Davis Posted April 13, 2017 Author Share Posted April 13, 2017 After reading the responses I think I will wait. I can't really see any huge advantage for us, and there would appear to be many potential disadvantages. Some years ago I had a device that was placed next to the conventional meter and sent details of consumption to a remote device. I had assumed that the Smart Meter would be something similar. Thank you for all your responses. regards Tony 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Reorte Posted April 13, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 13, 2017 I see no point in them - I use electricity when I need to, so I d, an ordinary meter records that so I can pay for it, any I despise anything with any hint of trying to constantly monitor what I do. I see little need for the supplier either - I assume the local substation gives them enough information about loading to be useful, and data for individual houses would be too grainy and noisy for any practical advantage over that. All the "advantages" strike me as dubious. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold chris p bacon Posted April 13, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 13, 2017 I'd not thought of the various conspiracy theories about having your power consumption monitored. But I would say that since having the smart meter fitted I don't have to wait around to have the meters read. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 I see no point in them - I use electricity when I need to, so I d, an ordinary meter records that so I can pay for it You sound like a traditional 'put the kettle on when Eastender's finished' user. Increasingly there are home generation, home batteries & heat storage and electric vehicles being thrown into the mix. When you make that post 'Enders cuppa that spike in demand might now come from your neighbour's battery. Maybe it's a sunny and windy day and there's a surplus of power. Your car won't normally charge 'till off-peak but now there's a couple of hours of unexpected cheap power so away it goes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold mcowgill Posted April 13, 2017 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 13, 2017 EON tried fitting one at our house, after 5 minutes the chap left saying it wasn't possible as there was no mobile signal... Martin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
APOLLO Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 They don't all charge this but be aware Early termination fees apply: £52 (inc. VAT) for either single or dual, and an additional £30 per meter for customers with smart meters. https://www.ukpower.co.uk/gas_electricity_suppliers/utilita/smart-energy I won't have any energy contract with early termination fees - rip off. No wonder the continentals call us "Treasure Island" !!! Brit15 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Reorte Posted April 13, 2017 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 13, 2017 I'd not thought of the various conspiracy theories about having your power consumption monitored. But I would say that since having the smart meter fitted I don't have to wait around to have the meters read. It's not really a fear about conspiracy theories, I just hate anything that smacks of someone looking over my shoulder all the time. Just because I've not got anything to hide doesn't mean I should have no issues with being watched. Very occasional meter readings aren't a particularly big hassle, most of the time I can do them myself, and when they did turn up (unannounced) to read the meter I just ended up with a card shoved through the door asking me to stick the numbers on it and leave it in the window if I was going to be out when they turned up again. Not really sure how that's more reliable than the usual asking me to fill them in online though! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG John Posted April 13, 2017 Share Posted April 13, 2017 I'd not thought of the various conspiracy theories about having your power consumption monitored. But I would say that since having the smart meter fitted I don't have to wait around to have the meters read. My meters are in boxes outside, so I don't know when they are read, until a get a bill with a reading shown. I read my meters regularly, keep the data on a spreadsheet to monitor my own usage, and provide a quarterly reading online to the suppliers. All nice and simple, except when the suppliers change their web sites, and I have to go searching for where to enter the reading! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Davis Posted April 13, 2017 Author Share Posted April 13, 2017 I am quite happy to supply my own readings, if I had been able to do that with my soon-to-be-previous supplier I wouldn't be having the arguments with them that I am now. Just occurred to me as well that if they can't get basic things like submitting a meter reading on-line then what are the chances of them getting the smart meter tech right? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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