Third-Rail EMU Photos

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Was this really 47 years ago? Southampton Central - May 1977.

[Darius43]

377s at West Worthing this afternoon.

 

 

Cheers

 

Darius

[phil_sutters]

Three trains in six minutes passing through Newhaven Town, with the Brighton-Seaford blocking my view of 66198 on the 10.49 Newhaven Marine aggregates to Cricklewood. That was running 12 minutes early, probably to minimise the level crossing waits for road traffic. If anyone is analysing my meta-data - I must have forgotten to put my camera 'clock' forward to BST!

 

 

 

Edited May 11 by phil_sutters

[Claude_Dreyfus]

 

An unidentified 377 (although may be 377105) approaches Amberley with the 1C32 13:05 Victoria - Portsmouth & Southsea on 10 May. A powerful zoom was required as this was taken from the viewpoint at the Chalk Pits Museum.

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Not quite sure how I ended up at Herne Hill yesterday, but one can only sit in a 468 bus for so long on a hot, stuffy day so I got off here. But it gave the opportunity to take of a photo two "007" units arriving simultaneously; 465007 bound for Victoria and 700007 for Blackfriars.

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Well, the 4-TC is classified as an EMU...

Crossing Holes Bay an hour or so ago, on 1Z35 1420 Swanage - Waterloo.

[5BarVT]

That’s a lot of HP, not sure who thinks what is going to fail!

Paul.

[Ray M]

Gatwick Express , Eastbourne.

[John M Upton]

6 hours ago, Ray M said:

Gatwick Express , Eastbourne.

 

To become a regular sight at Southampton from the beginning of June too.  They won't be actually going to Gatwick though....

[Gwiwer]

45 minutes ago, John M Upton said:

They won't be actually going to Gatwick though...

They carried GatEx branding all the way to Cambridge and still weren’t going to Gatwick. You would need the even-harder seats of a 700 to make that journey. 
 

Surely given that there are normally no dedicated “Gatwick Express” workings at all - the fast ones are Brighton services these days - it must be time to re-brand?  
 

It’s the dreaded p-word getting in the way again. Pottylicks. 

[John M Upton]

Well, supposedly the GN 387's in dealer stock white (yes, just change the fleet names for the third time!) are heading south at the end of the year when GN get the ex Stansted Express 379's which in turn is meant to send the errant GatEx red ones back to proper GatEx work.  I have to sign 387's by the end of the year I have been told.

[Peter Kazmierczak]

I feel that the Electrostar family of units look their best in GatEx red...

[stewartingram]

A sensible livery, none of those awful shapes that don't correspond to the body panels. I also like the GN version, though I'm no fan of white-based liveries.

[Peter Kazmierczak]

You'll have to take my word, but this is last Saturday's 1C12 0805 Victoria - Chichester & Bognor Regis, crossing Brighton Road in Coulsdon, on the Quarry line. Taken from the top deck of the 405 bus heading for Redhill.

[Siberian Snooper]

I  can remember when the 405 ran from Horsham to Reigate, does it still do that? It was a LT Green Line service.

 

 

[DY444]

15 hours ago, John M Upton said:

Well, supposedly the GN 387's in dealer stock white (yes, just change the fleet names for the third time!) are heading south at the end of the year when GN get the ex Stansted Express 379's which in turn is meant to send the errant GatEx red ones back to proper GatEx work.  I have to sign 387's by the end of the year I have been told.

 

Yep.  The first 379s are being cycled through Hornsey as part of the work to return them to service.

[Gwiwer]

1 hour ago, Siberian Snooper said:

I  can remember when the 405 ran from Horsham to Reigate, does it still do that? It was a LT Green Line service.

 

 

The 414 was the Horsham - Reigate bus.  That and the 405 used to link Horsham and Redhill then on to West Croydon.  The 414 ran via Dorking and the 405 via Crawley
 

The 405 hasn’t done that since around 1971

There is no trace of the 414 at all these days nor the 405 south of Redhill. The 405 runs between Croydon and Redhill as part of the TfL network and under agreement with Surrey County Council but via a different route; it no longer serves London Road through Croydon. 

You can still travel over closely-similar routes to the old 405/414 by changing buses in Dorking or Crawley, Redhill and Purley. 

 

 

 

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Yep, the 405 starts in Park Street, Croydon, then round the houses to Purley, Then down the Brighton Road through Coulsdon and Merstham to Redhill bus station, opposite the railway station. 

[KeithHC]

The 405 and sometimes the 440 where my transport from Salfords to Redhill for school. Starting off with RTs and RFs then RCLs . But then I got a moped……

 

Keith

[eastwestdivide]

Does this count as third rail? An ex-Thameslink ex-GWR ex-319, 769949, being towed from Long Marston to Doncaster just as the heavens opened. Rotherham today, with 37800 doing the work at the front.

 

Edited May 14 by eastwestdivide

[Siberian Snooper]

6 hours ago, Gwiwer said:

The 414 was the Horsham - Reigate bus.  That and the 405 used to link Horsham and Redhill then on to West Croydon.  The 414 ran via Dorking and the 405 via Crawley
 

The 405 hasn’t done that since around 1971

There is no trace of the 414 at all these days nor the 405 south of Redhill. The 405 runs between Croydon and Redhill as part of the TfL network and under agreement with Surrey County Council but via a different route; it no longer serves London Road through Croydon. 

You can still travel over closely-similar routes to the old 405/414 by changing buses in Dorking or Crawley, Redhill and Purley. 

 

 

 

 

'71 was when I left Horsham for the Devon, hence the question.

 

 

[Gwiwer]

On 13/05/2024 at 16:13, John M Upton said:

Well, supposedly the GN 387's in dealer stock white (yes, just change the fleet names for the third time!) are heading south at the end of the year when GN get the ex Stansted Express 379's which in turn is meant to send the errant GatEx red ones back to proper GatEx work.  I have to sign 387's by the end of the year I have been told.

Surely not for 15-minute headway GAtEx shuttles?  The pathways have been recycled for other services now.  In my opinion, that of many railway colleagues, but not of the Computer-Gazing Gentlemen in Suits who suggested there was adequate capacity the Brighton Line was over-used and requried thinning out slightly.  It probably requires a little more thinning now post-Covid.

 

This is from pre- and post-Covid observations of services passing Clapham Junction and frequent travel the length of the Brighton main line:

Southern services are often very full to overloaded including with airport passengers having luggage stacked the length of the gangways and obstructing doorways;

GatEx services are generally lightly used owing to the premium fares charged for airport journeys and the non-stop nature of the service although for airport users and authorities the latter point is highly desirable;

Thameslink services are generally lightly used south of Gatwick / Three Bridges;

There is a clear and very strong demand for Gatwick to / fro East Croydon and Clapham Junction largely for interchange purposes which the GatEx service does not meet;

Services on the Brighton main line are frequently delayed by congestion at numerous pinch-points and by dwell times at a handful of stations - Clapham, East Croydon and Gatwick. 

 

So to my (retired professional railwayman) mind - leaving aside all "railway politics" - the solution may lie somewhere in this:

Maintain the 30-minute fast services between Victoria - Gatwick - Brighton but with one per hour calling at Clapham Junction and the other at East Croydon;

Revert to the all-day half-hourly timetables towards Littlehampton and Eastbourne closing the remaining hourly gaps during the morning and afternoon;

Remove the Mid-Sussex stops from Littlehampton trains and accelerate them by at least 10 minutes (restoring the 1930s timings!); retain the Wivelsfield stops on Eastbourne services as no other service offers that direct link and they are travelling very slowly there anyway to negotiate Keymer Junction;

Withdrawn one-per-hour Thameslink service from the Brighton - Bedford and Brighton - Cambridge routes south of Gatwick Airport (or Three Bridges for operational reasons i.e. that's where the depot is)

Introduce a one-an-hour Southern service Brighton and all stations to Gatwick Airport then non - stop to Victoria partially covering the withdrawn Mid-Sussex stops on Littlehampton / Thameslink services and maintaining a non-stop Gatwick - Victoria service;

Remove all premium fares; all fares between Gatwick and London Terminals to be valid on all trains.  They are all run by one TOC after all.  At least for now.  

Most trains to be 12-car once stock is available.

The net effect is to reduce by one train per hour the service south of East Croydon easing congestion whilst maintaining capacity but increase it by one an hour from there to Victoria. 

 

[Gwiwer]

And to prove that I don't just offer armchair expertise here ..... here's my shot of a class 455 unit calling at Clapham Junction just before dawn on a Down service.  

 

[Gwiwer]

Meanwhile at the other end of the day an evening service prepares to depart from Waterloo with the London Eye in the background and a class 444 in the main line platforms

 

[John M Upton]

Good evening from the Night Shift...