Birmingham Hope St- BR (ex GCR) Minories Style Urban Layout 1965

[danstercivicman]

The Wombourne Branch ( Oxley Junction to Kingswinford) is about the best bet, mostly single track and used as a Wolverhampton and Dudley by-pass for Shrewsbury to Worcester traffic, it saw use by a large volume of large locos before closure. I'd always looked at the S&MJR for modelling ( with family connections with Kineton & Tysoe ), but in reality it was freight only after 1952. Both closed about the same time due to the rapid decline in traffic at that period.

It's a nice bike ride that but On my hybrid not my road bike

 

Such a shame the route is lifted...

 

Same with wolves to Dudley, sheer lunacy wrecking that line

Edited March 18, 2018 by danstercivicman

[TheSignalEngineer]

Just looking at the SMJ... looks very interesting and somewhat of a failure, success then failure. If only they had kept these lines now...

 

Quite a nice area and it looks like the GC had slip coaches and expresses at times..

Before I settled on a Black Country location for my layout I looked at using the GC proposal to take over the SMJ, with the section from Woodford Halse to Stratford Old Town being doubled and then heading off on an independent line to join the original North Warwickshire proposal of an independent line to Birmingham. This was scuppered by the GWR bailing out the North Warwickshire line and getting the route changed to link with the existing GWR lines at Bearley and Tyseley. The SMJ would continue as a single line to Broom Junction.

 

My interest in the area partly came from working in the Fenny Compton and Stratford areas. My Grandfather worked on the alterations to put in the South curve from the SMJ to the Barnt Green - Redditch - Ashchurch line at Broom Junction in 1942. I later found that his Grandfather was born at Combrook, near to Kineton.

Edited March 19, 2018 by TheSignalEngineer

[danstercivicman]

Before I settled on a Black Country location fro my layout I looked at using the GC proposal to take over the SMJ, with the section from Woodford Halse to Stratford Old Town being doubled and then heading off on an independent line to join the original North Warwickshire proposal of an independent line to Birmingham. This was scuppered by the GWR bailing out the North Warwickshire line and getting the route changed to link with the existing GWR lines at Bearley and Tyseley. The SMJ would continue as a single line to Broom Junction.

 

My interest in the area partly came from working in the Fenny Compton and Stratford areas. My Grandfather worked on the alterations to put in the South curve from the SMJ to the Barnt Green - Redditch - Ashchurch line at Broom Junction in 1942. I later found that his Grandfather was born at Combrook, near to Kineton.

That is quite useful information. I guess then my GC terminus in Birmingham could have used that route?

[danstercivicman]

Banbury Merton Street could be a good idea?

 

Does anyone have a track plan?

[TheSignalEngineer]

https://www.s-r-s.org.uk/html/lmsr/M646.gif

 

At the time when the OWW Bill was going through Parliament the L&B tried to put up a spoiler scheme from Tring via Aylesbury and Banbury to Worcester and Wolverhampton. Another interesting neverwazza layout could be made out of that one.

[woodenhead]

Definately and worked by Ivatt 4MT's

 

Here is my Scottish Region Plan using one of CJF's Plans.

 

Pros

 

1) Wiring diagram exists in his book

2) Its more scenic with ID back scenes hills and dales

3) It allows freight and passenger

4) It allows fish/meat traffic somehow?

 

Cons

 

1) Stock needs to be changed to Scottish Region Stock

2) It will need some class 26/27's

3) I will take licence in that Sulzer Type 2's worked into it

If you dropped the sidings at right angles at the bottom to give you more space at the top you could do a Kyle of Lockalsh type station

[danstercivicman]

Sometimes the ideas I come up with are just odd...

 

 

[danstercivicman]

If you dropped the sidings at right angles at the bottom to give you more space at the top you could do a Kyle of Lockalsh type station

Good idea and a great prototype

 

There is of course the Langholm branch which used ivatt 4mts

[Pacific231G]

Banbury Merton Street could be a good idea?

 

Does anyone have a track plan?

Hi Dan

I've found one in Railway Modeller from April 1962. It'll still be copyright so I'll PM it to you. 

Somewhere I think I have a more detailed article but can't lay hands on it just now.

[danstercivicman]

Hi Dan

I've found one in Railway Modeller from April 1962. It'll still be copyright so I'll PM it to you.

Somewhere I think I have a more detailed article but can't lay hands on it just now.

Thank yo that would be much appreciated it looks like quite a good basis for an idea

[Joseph_Pestell]

Hi Dan

I've found one in Railway Modeller from April 1962. It'll still be copyright so I'll PM it to you. 

Somewhere I think I have a more detailed article but can't lay hands on it just now.

Beat me to it, David. I remembered that article.

 

I think that it also appears in one of the OPC LMS books and definitely good coverage in a two-volume book about the Oxford-Cambridge LNW line. I don't still have my copy of that though.

 

Merton St was quite limited in its operational scope but there could be some Rule One modifications.

 

Edit: Just checked in the "library". Volume One of Historical Survey of Selected LMS stations.

Edited March 19, 2018 by Joseph_Pestell

[danstercivicman]

Cheers both,

 

It looks like it is a possibility...

[bike2steam]

That is quite useful information. I guess then my GC terminus in Birmingham could have used that route?

 

And just think, L1's could have worked further than Stratford Town.   

[danstercivicman]

And just think, L1's could have worked further than Stratford Town.

I have some pictures of them further than that..somewhere

[danstercivicman]

I have been reading about Banbury Merton St. It appears cattle, coal, milk and other goods were all common with dwindling passenger numbers.

 

The GC seem to have used it a lot along with some bizarre LMs Road Railers!

[bike2steam]

I have some pictures of them further than that..somewhere

 

That'd be interesting to see, I'd always thought that Stratford (Old) Town was the furthest south-west they worked, on route-learning trips for Woodford Halse crews. I know a K1 somehow managed to get to Cardiff .

Banbury Merton Street, used to be nearly next door to General station, with the cattle market between, rarely saw anything other than 0-6-0's, and 2-6-2T's, it was cattle traffic more than passengers that kept the branch alive (just).

[TheSignalEngineer]

And just think, L1's could have worked further than Stratford Town.

Furthest I have seen was Evesham Road Crossing on a road learner when the South Curve was put in.

[Pacific231G]

I have been reading about Banbury Merton St. It appears cattle, coal, milk and other goods were all common with dwindling passenger numbers.

 

The GC seem to have used it a lot along with some bizarre LMs Road Railers!

I found some photos of it here.

http://www.steve-banks.org/banbury/270-banbury-merton-street-station

It's not the most attractive terminus I've ever seen and the LNWR seem to have spared every expense in building it. It does appear rather like a goods yard with a passenger station tucked into it but Banbury did apparently have the largest cattle market in Europe. 

The GC line I remembered to Woodford Halse never used Merton St. of course but the station had in any case gone long before I ever visited Banbury

[danstercivicman]

I found some photos of it here.

http://www.steve-banks.org/banbury/270-banbury-merton-street-station

It's not the most attractive terminus I've ever seen and the LNWR seem to have spared every expense in building it. It does appear rather like a goods yard with a passenger station tucked into it but Banbury did apparently have the largest cattle market in Europe.

The GC line I remembered to Woodford Halse never used Merton St. of course but the station had in any case gone long before I ever visited Banbury

It does, all the pictures show Lines of cattle wagons and a big coal yard!

 

Do you know if Keswick would be a good track plan idea? Information on it seems scarce

[bike2steam]

 

It's not the most attractive terminus I've ever seen and the LNWR seem to have spared every expense in building it. 

All wood, if I remember rightly ?? 

[Joseph_Pestell]

It does, all the pictures show Lines of cattle wagons and a big coal yard!

 

Do you know if Keswick would be a good track plan idea? Information on it seems scarce

 

Rather different -  because it's a through station. But reasonably interesting with 3-car portions of the Lakes Express from Euston as well as local traffic.

 

I have the plan somewhere.

 

How much space have you got available? And do you have preferences as to era, region, etc?

Edited March 20, 2018 by Joseph_Pestell

[bike2steam]

Furthest I have seen was Evesham Road Crossing on a road learner when the South Curve was put in.

 

I suppose they also used the north curve into the GW station to reverse the train of, usually, 3 brake vans ??  

[danstercivicman]

I suppose they also used the north curve into the GW station to reverse the train of, usually, 3 brake vans ??

It looks like the spur links to the GWR goods yard from what I can see

[danstercivicman]

Thank you all for your kind words and help.

 

I've got three ideas buzzing around my head...

 

1) Scottish themed BLT Kyle of Localsh

 

2) Banbury Merton St themed urban layout

 

And now I'm the blue corner...

 

3) Windermere Lakeside?? Taking the Kyle of Localsh and transporting it to the Lake District?

 

With that in mind what are your thoughts?

 

The space I have to model is 5m by 1.8m max.

 

Ideally end to end but I'd consider any workable other plans (without gradients)

[Pacific231G]

Thank you all for your kind words and help.

I've got three ideas buzzing around my head...

1) Scottish themed BLT Kyle of Localsh

2) Banbury Merton St themed urban layout

And now I'm the blue corner...

3) Windermere Lakeside?? Taking the Kyle of Localsh and transporting it to the Lake District?

With that in mind what are your thoughts?

The space I have to model is 5m by 1.8m max.

Ideally end to end but I'd consider any workable other plans (without gradients)

These are just random thoughts.

Kyle sounds more like a single track main than a BLT but might suffer from a lack of trains. Though I have happy memories of watching operations at the original Fort William , a station that does attract me, these were short bursts of intense activity just a few times each day.

 

Banbury Merton Street doesn't appeal to me at all. Despite a link to an adjoining main line, it's essentially a BLT with the limited variety of trains typical of real branch lines and there are plenty of much more attractive BLTs.

 

I don't know much about Windermere's potential traffic but if it could handle excursions and even express sections, a bit like an inland Kingswear, then it might be interesting. Would it allow you to use much of your existing stock?