RMweb Gold Ruston Posted November 27, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 27, 2016 (edited) I don't have anything like as many photo of 165s as I have of 48 and 88DS but I do have some sales literature so if people have photos of 165s, please add them. Ruston & Hornsby 165s come in three flavours - mechanical (DS), electric (DE) and hydraulic (DH). There external detail differences between the types as well as changes that are dependent on the age of the loco. Starting with the DS British Railways owned a few 165DS and this picture shows the arrangement of the jackshaft and rods on the BR locos. Some industrial locos used this arrangement, as shown here... Some 165DS had the rods arranged so there was one rod from the jackshaft to the front wheels and a connecting rod between the wheels, as shown here... Then there are oddities, such as this one with a different radiator grille. This loco also appears to have a longer frame and the part of the bonnet in front of the frame is longer, presumably to accommodate something uhder there - a compressor or an exhaust scrubber? https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8165/7275168032_e29998dd4c_b.jpg Then we have the 165DE. The traction motor on the DE locos drove straight to the rear axle so no jackshaft was used. Some (early?) DE looked the same as the DS but for the lack of jackshaft but some (later?) locos had recessed steps for shunters, at the front end. Another visual clue to a DE is the extra cast plates under the maker's name. These plates show the manufacturer of the electrical equipment - BTH. Early 165DE... https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7171/6686496985_9324c31a0c_b.jpg This loco has jacking points under the buffers. Some have a plate, held by 4 bolts and some have nothing. This one doesn't have the recessed steps but has larger cab rear windows... https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7028/6680871095_0d4b4b1b92_b.jpg This one has both large windows and recessed steps... https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8755/16768866530_2293c430b2_b.jpg Later locos also had a raked back front to the cab, as shown in the drawing below. Early 165DE. Later 165DE, also showing 0-6-0 version. And then the 165DH. The first DH looked exactly like an early DS and even had the jackshaft arrangement of the BR 165DS locos. Later DH locos had a jackshaft and rod arrangement that was different from the DS, as shown in this photo and in the drawing below... https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3947/15566846930_9ff29e4fdf_b.jpg The engine access doors are also different but I do not know if all DH locos were like this. I've had enough for now. If people are interested I can post some detail shots and specifications. It would be nice if we can get pictures we can post on screen instead of having to get around the copyright rules by linking to them, so if you have any please post them and I'll replace/add them. Edited March 8, 2023 by Ruston 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGH Posted November 27, 2016 Share Posted November 27, 2016 (edited) I don't have anything like as many photo of 165s as I have of 48 and 88DS but I do have some sales literature so if people have photos of 165s, please add them. It would be nice if we can get pictures we can post on screen instead of having to get around the copyright rules by linking to them, so if you have any please post them and I'll replace/add them. British Railways owned a few 165DS and this picture shows the arrangement of the jackshaft and rods on the BR locos. Some industrial locos used this arrangement, as shown here Happy to oblige: Photo taken at ICI's Smalldale Plant at Peak Forest in August 1967 RH 395305 - supplied new in 1956 to ICI Ltd., Weston Point Works, Runcorn; to ICI's Smalldale Plant, Peak Forest in 1966; to ICI's South Central Workshops, Tunstead circa 1968; to Foxfield Railway, December 1975; to Northamptonshire Ironstone Railway Trust, Hunsbury Hill, September 1997 (info from Industrial Railway Society records) Edited October 15, 2018 by PGH 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarryP Posted November 27, 2016 Share Posted November 27, 2016 (edited) Love the picture of the DS at the cement works in Purfleet, just down the road from me. Having just built the Judith Edge O gauge kit as the BR version at Stratford, I wondered if anyone had any information on cab details? Photos would be really helpful. Edited November 27, 2016 by HarryP Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium pete_mcfarlane Posted November 27, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 27, 2016 This one has both large windows and recessed steps... https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8755/16768866530_2293c430b2_b.jpg Having seen this one a few times on the SVR, I'm assuming that the non-standard sliding bonnet doors are a modification by one of it's later owners, rather than a Ruston feature. They look a bit home made. Here's some 165DE photos culled from my thread on building the Judith Edge kit. Starting at the beginning, here's the very first 165DE. 268881 of 1950 at the Electric Railway Museum (Coventry) back in 2010. Straight front cab, no lifting lugs under the footplate, steps not inset. Two separate handrails on the cab side. This one is at the Ecclesbourne Valley in 2008, and I believe it's 402803 of 1956. Similar to the previous one - note how the cab windows are rectangular, the cab side handrails join together, and the front footsteps are inset. 421436 of 1958, with the later sloping front cab and inset footsteps. At the Rutland Railway museum tback in the summer. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ruston Posted November 27, 2016 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 27, 2016 (edited) An unidentified 165DS at an unknown location. Ruston & Hornsby photo, taken in 1950. Edited March 8, 2023 by Ruston 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ruston Posted November 27, 2016 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 27, 2016 (edited) RH photo from 1963, at Colviles Ltd. A 165DE. Large rear windows, recessed steps but with different sides to the bonnet plus compressor housing. Note also the cabside badge - the electrical equipment being provided by AEI. Edited March 8, 2023 by Ruston 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesperus Posted November 27, 2016 Share Posted November 27, 2016 Seen at the Telford Steam Railway 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ruston Posted November 27, 2016 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 27, 2016 (edited) A variant of the DE was the Tandem loco. These were designed to be used singly or in pairs and used electro-pneumatic multiple working. Another slight variation are the small lower windows in the front panel of the cab. Showing the safety chains, air piping and communicating rear cab door. Edited March 8, 2023 by Ruston 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGH Posted November 27, 2016 Share Posted November 27, 2016 (edited) Two 165HP locomotives were rebuilt by ICI Ltd with raised cabs and lowered bonnets for greater visibility and used at Tunstead Quarry, Derbyshire. RH 418598 TREVITHICK a 165DE 0-4-0 built in 1957 is shown at Tunstead in 1969 RH 281264 a 165DS 0-6-0 built in 1950 and also photographed in 1969 Both locomotives went to preservation centres, RH 418598 to Southport and RH 281264 to Butterley, but were later scrapped Edited October 15, 2018 by PGH 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ruston Posted November 28, 2016 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 28, 2016 (edited) Some info for modelling 165HP Rustons. If you're modelling the cab interior... Early DE. Late DE. Engines: Despite this series of locomotives all being designated 165xx only the DS had their engines rated at that horsepower (at 1250 r.p.m.). The DE, which used the same Ruston 6VPH normally-aspirated diesel was rated at 155HP at 1250 r.p.m.. The DH locos, which used the Ruston 6YEX turbo-charged engine, which was rated 165HP at 1800 r.p.m. Although the engines are rarely modelled it makes a difference to what sound chip you may want to add. Although no one does sound for any of these locos you could use something at least similar so a Rolls Royce sound is going to be more suitable for the DH but something slow-running such as the chip for a BR class 03 may be better suited to a DS. I can't think of anything suitable for the DE with the slow-running engine but no gearchange sounds. Edited March 8, 2023 by Ruston 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold russ p Posted November 28, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 28, 2016 I take it the twin unit was rare, did any survive? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted November 28, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 28, 2016 British Railways owned a few 165DS and this picture shows the arrangement of the jackshaft and rods on the BR locos. I think only two were taken into capital stock at Stratford depot D2957 & D2958 There is a 88DS masquerading as D2957 Cheers, Mick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ruston Posted November 28, 2016 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted November 28, 2016 Interesting. The BR locos have the exhaust near the front of the bonnet but I have yet to see ain industrial version with the exhaust there. The industrials all seem to have the exhaust centred against the cab front. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium newbryford Posted November 28, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 28, 2016 Interesting. The BR locos have the exhaust near the front of the bonnet but I have yet to see ain industrial version with the exhaust there. The industrials all seem to have the exhaust centred against the cab front. There's a few more pics here Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackstareasyrider Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 Thank you for your post about Ruston DS165's. I'm pleased to say that Ruston 395305 has been owned by Myself at The Helston Railway in Cornwall since 2007. It has been working pulling brake van rides although has just undergone a very expensive radiator overhaul which meant taking it out of service. It is due to be dual braked when it comes back later this year. I would be very interested to know what livery it carried whilst working for ICI. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackstareasyrider Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 395305 at Trevarno 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGH Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 (edited) Thank you for your post about Ruston DS165's. I'm pleased to say that Ruston 395305 has been owned by Myself at The Helston Railway in Cornwall since 2007. It has been working pulling brake van rides although has just undergone a very expensive radiator overhaul which meant taking it out of service. It is due to be dual braked when it comes back later this year. I would be very interested to know what livery it carried whilst working for ICI. When I photographed it at Smalldale in August 1967 - as shown in Post #2 above - I noted the livery as blue with black underframe and buffer beams; red buffers, handrails and coupling rods. Officially it was "RS 154" but there was no evidence of that on the loco or any other lettering. Edited October 15, 2018 by PGH Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Ruston Posted August 14, 2017 Author RMweb Gold Share Posted August 14, 2017 As this topic has been brought up again I have edited all my posts to reinstate the photos that were lost, in the Photobucket ransom.. 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beatty 139 Posted August 14, 2017 Share Posted August 14, 2017 Ex 165 DE AEI plate if someone wants some more detail. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Down_Under Posted August 15, 2017 Share Posted August 15, 2017 Thanks Dave for updating the links. Big thumbs up. I have a question - what govenered the choice of DS, DE or DH drive for operators? A personal preference or operational requirements? Are some better a low speed while others better a more trip workings? It's something I've pondered, but not got round to asking. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hartleymartin Posted November 10, 2017 Share Posted November 10, 2017 (edited) Well, at least one of them went as far as Australia:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commonwealth_Railways_DR_class I think there is also a derelict one as late as the 1980s in Sydney at SimsMetal (scrap metal merchants) Edited November 10, 2017 by hartleymartin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Down_Under Posted July 24, 2020 Share Posted July 24, 2020 Hello all, Any recommendations on books to purchase/acquire that detail production numbers of these beasts and where they ended up (similar to Rustons book on the 48/88DS)? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poor Old Bruce Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 Published by the Industrial Railway Society in 1974. ISBN 0 901096 21 0, 92 pages 6.5in x 9in. Lots of photos and lists. 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 There is also the Ruston & Hornsby Diesel Locomotive Album published by Plateway Press. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Down_Under Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 (edited) Thanks PoB! Just ordered a copy. I'd have to agree with one of Ruston's earlier comments - they seem rather unphotographed in industrial service compared to other types. Is that because fewer were manufactured? Id been keen to also understand what would prompt a user to decide between a DS/DH/EDE version? And why so any varieties offered by Ruston. Cost? Power? Continuous runnning (trip,workings?) vs occasional shunting operation? If if anyone has any pictures of them in NCB service I'd be interested. J Edited July 25, 2020 by Down_Under Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now