More Pre-Grouping Wagons in 4mm - the D299 appreciation thread.

[Compound2632]

6 minutes ago, Buhar said:

D-limonene, IIRC, emerged on here when folk were assembling styrene parts cut on a Silhouette machine, particularly the lacework for panelling coaches which was 10 thou and liable to distortion with standard solvents.

 

Indeed, I started using it for just that purpose. I must get back to that model!

 

I think I bought mine at an exhibition, whether when Wizard were still attending exhibitions, or from another trader - possibly Squires?

[MrWolf]

A few pages back there was mention of Stableford & Co.

We were over at Embsay yesterday picking up some parts for the Memsahib's Triumph Herald, only 150 yards from the station so we took a wander after lunch and I came across this: 

 

 

I wasn't aware that they were making parts for the Great Western as well.

 

[Compound2632]

34 minutes ago, MrWolf said:

A few pages back there was mention of Stableford & Co.

We were over at Embsay yesterday picking up some parts for the Memsahib's Triumph Herald, only 150 yards from the station so we took a wander after lunch and I came across this: 

 

I infer, from the footboard, that this is on a goods brake van?

 

It might be an idea to post this as a topic in the GWR rolling stock sub-forum, where it may get some expert attention.

[Penlan]

[andytrains]

Is this the same LNWR cattle wagon wagon?

[Compound2632]

15 minutes ago, andytrains said:

Is this the same LNWR cattle wagon wagon?

 

It looks to me to be a D21 medium cattle wagon but I think it may be a different kit to the D&S one i'm building. The flap door has the later style of hinges, curving at the top, and it's got a brake vee-hanger which the D&S kit doesn't have. But it's possible those are modifications to the D&S kit - can you check if they are integral to the castings or added parts?

 

Also, how long is it over headstocks? The proportions look right to me for a medium cattle wagon but it might just be a large one. 

 

Incidentally, the kit I've been building isn't listed in the 2005 D&S catalogue, of which I have a copy and which I believe was the last one issued.

[MrWolf]

4 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

I infer, from the footboard, that this is on a goods brake van?

 

It might be an idea to post this as a topic in the GWR rolling stock sub-forum, where it may get some expert attention.

 

It is, although for the purposes of this thread, I was more interested in the manufacturer than the customer. 

Although it was early on the industrial scene, Coalville is a tiny place in comparison with other industrial areas and I was surprised to see Stablefords name on anything other than a PO wagon or something from Derby.

[andytrains]

The hinges are a brass etch. The main body is whitemetal.

The V hangaer is integral to the casting, but there is also an etched one on the other side, making it a double V hanger.

The headstock is 16ft.

It did have Vac pipes, but I have removed what was left of them as they were broken.

There were no buffers.

The rest of the underframe was not present when acquired, along with a few D&S GN wagons/Vans.

Thanks.

Andy.

Edited July 22, 2023 by andytrains

[Compound2632]

6 minutes ago, andytrains said:

The hinges are a brass etch. The main body is whitemetal.

The V hangaer is integral to the casting, but there is also an etched one on the other side, making it a double V hanger.

The headstock is 16ft.

It did have Vac pipes, but I have removed what was left of them as they were broken.

There were no buffers.

The rest of the underframe was not present when acquired, along with a few D&S GN wagons/Vans.

 

Then I suppose it is the D&S kit, but of a different vintage to mine.

[Compound2632]

12 minutes ago, MrWolf said:

Although it was early on the industrial scene, Coalville is a tiny place in comparison with other industrial areas and I was surprised to see Stablefords name on anything other than a PO wagon or something from Derby.

 

But Stableford was a relatively big firm. Many of these firms seem to have had foundries and could cast their own axleboxes. Of course Swindon was well set-up in that respect too. It appears to be an RCH 1923 specification axlebox, so, given the 1924 date, maybe Stableford were quick off the mark casting them, Swindon having been caught on the hop?

[Andy Hayter]

3 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Incidentally, the kit I've been building isn't listed in the 2005 D&S catalogue, of which I have a copy and which I believe was the last one issued.

 

 

Possibly DS 405 LNWR LNWR 10t Cattle wagon.  Listed in the 1986 catalogue but not in the 2005 one.

 

 

[Compound2632]

8 minutes ago, Andy Hayter said:

Possibly DS 405 LNWR LNWR 10t Cattle wagon.  Listed in the 1986 catalogue but not in the 2005 one.

 

I looked at (not read) the instructions just now - says DS 406, so perhaps DS 405 was a large cattle wagon, D22?

[MrWolf]

1 hour ago, Compound2632 said:

 

But Stableford was a relatively big firm. Many of these firms seem to have had foundries and could cast their own axleboxes. Of course Swindon was well set-up in that respect too. It appears to be an RCH 1923 specification axlebox, so, given the 1924 date, maybe Stableford were quick off the mark casting them, Swindon having been caught on the hop?

 

I suspect that you're right there. It wouldn't be implausible that Swindon found themselves overstretched trying to update the stock they had inherited in 1923 alongside their own build programme.

 

The D&S LNWR cattle vans turn up from time to time and if I remember right they offered kits for early and late pattern 10 ton versions. 

Given the prices being asked for these obsolete kits, the demand is obviously still there.

I remember being rather taken by the MR ballast brake kit, but I was fifteen and broke!

[Compound2632]

10 minutes ago, MrWolf said:

I remember being rather taken by the MR ballast brake kit, but I was fifteen and broke!

 

I still haven't finished mine, started over 30 years ago:

 

 

This kit is currently available from London Road Models:

http://londonroadmodels.com/rolling_stock_pages/brake_etc.php

[Chas Levin]

22 hours ago, Rowsley17D said:

Pedant mode on.

 

Can I just point out that solvents do not melt plastic, a high temperature is required to do that. Solvents dissolve plastic.

 

Thank you.

 

Jonathan,

 

Nice point, however, you didn't switch pedant mode off: significant battery drain...

Edited July 23, 2023 by Chas Levin

[Andy Hayter]

51 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

I looked at (not read) the instructions just now - says DS 406, so perhaps DS 405 was a large cattle wagon, D22?

 

Sorry I should have said.  It is listed as dia. 21.

 

 DS 406 is not listed nor 407.

 

D&S 1986-7.pdf

[Compound2632]

Now, now. I'm all for accuracy of fact and expression here. 

 

But you take me back to teaching Year 7 science and the lesson starter activity of matching terms to definitions- solvent, solute, dissolve, solution...

[Compound2632]

17 minutes ago, Andy Hayter said:

DS 406 is not listed nor 407.

 

Thanks. That suggests my D21, D&S 406, is a kit that had been deleted by 1986! (406 and 407 marked W.)

 

Also, looking at the drawing in that catalogue, it is clear that @andytrains's one is D&S 405 - it shows the later style of drop flap ironwork, brake vee-hanger, and vac pipes.

Edited July 22, 2023 by Compound2632

[MrWolf]

That at least makes sense of my recollection that there were two variants made by D&S.

[Compound2632]

Moving from ancient whitemetal to up-to-the-minute resin, here's a new kit hot off the press - or out of the printer - from Mousa Models:

 

 

This is a D353 8-ton covered goods wagon to Drg. 401, of which 1,220 were built from 1880 up to 1892, before being succeeded by wagons that were first 6" taller - D356 - then 12" taller - D357, but built to the same drawing. Axlebox enthusiasts will observe that the print has 10A axleboxes, indicating that it represents one of the 300 vehicles from Lots 236, 248, and 287, lot 236 having been entered in the lot list with a date of 10 December 1889, which, as discussed above in response to a question of @billbedford's, is some time after the first lots of wagons known to have been given the 10A axlebox.

 

This is a newly-released model, ref. BWK1710; I also ordered a couple that have been in the catalogue for a while, the Lot 29 highside wagon, ref. BWK1708:

 

 

and the Drg. 10 lowside wagon, ref. BWK1711:

 

 

I had a couple of the lowside wagons before; this is a revised print - both this and the Lot 29 wagon now have an improved representation of the early Clayton brake gear, with wooden brake blocks, long lever, and cross-shaft supported by a "I-hanger" or single strut at the rear. This is now all printed integrally with the body, so one has to specify the gauge when ordering - these are 00 so there is the inevitable distortion in the position of the brake gear relative to the V-hanger. 

 

These are all photographed straight out of the box. The only additional parts are the floors of the open wagons (the roof of the covered goods wagon is a tight fit to the body and delivered in place), the inner axleguards and wire for the suspension system, and the parts for the sprung buffers.

 

I had some difficulty getting postable photos. I find unpainted resin often doesn't photograph well and this being a dark-coloured resin, I had problems with contrast - in the images posted, I have used image editing software to increase the brightness.

[magmouse]

This kind of subject is tricky to photograph - the wagon itself doesn’t have much contrast, being all grey, but there is a big contrast with the white background. The camera’s meter struggles to set an exposure that gives what we want. If possible, increase the exposure when taking the photo, allowing the white background to over-expose but getting detail into the wagon.

 

If you need to adjust afterwards, see if your editing software has an explore adjustment, rather than using brightness - it will likely give better results. Failing that, increase the brightness as you did, but also increase the contrast setting. Increasing the brightness lifts all the values in the image, so you end up with no darker areas - that’s why you get the flat, washed out look. Adding more contrast fixes that.

 

Nick.

[Compound2632]

1 hour ago, magmouse said:

If you need to adjust afterwards, see if your editing software has an explore adjustment, rather than using brightness - it will likely give better results. Failing that, increase the brightness as you did, but also increase the contrast setting. Increasing the brightness lifts all the values in the image, so you end up with no darker areas - that’s why you get the flat, washed out look. Adding more contrast fixes that.

 

Contrast increased to maximum, brightness increased as before:

 

 

The choice of white background, rather than my usual green cutting mat and cardboard toolbox, is driven by the thought of photography for publication. I'll dig out the pastel blue and pastel green paper I've used on previous occasions and see if that improves matters.

 

For reference, here's a finished model (Slaters kit) taken under the same conditions (combination of natural and artificial light):

 

 

and the same, but with the white background removed:

 

 

demonstrating Nick's point about the effect of contrast with the background.

Edited July 23, 2023 by Compound2632

[billbedford]

Thanks for the heads-up, Stephen. 

 

I've added a menu on the webpage for these vans so that they can be suppled with either 8A or 10A axle boxes. I'll make the same change on the other 14ft 11in wagons, probably sometime next week.  

[magmouse]

Are these taken on your phone? The first picture in your most recent post is getting there is terms of detail retrieval, but in the process we are getting a lot of noise and nasty colour artefacts. That’s a result of under-exposure in the camera and then greatly increasing the brightness and contrast later.

 

The camera under-exposes in a situation like this because it wants to make the average of the whole picture a middling grey. It sees all that white background and thinks it needs to reduce the exposure to make that background darker. Changing the background is a work-round, as you have found, but the real answer is to control the exposure when taking the picture. Most cameras (including phones) have a way to adjust the exposure the auto system is setting - often called “exposure compensation” or something like that.

 

Nick.

[Compound2632]

3 hours ago, magmouse said:

Are these taken on your phone?

 

All my photos throughout this topic are taken with a Panasonic Lumix DMC-FS62, a small camera that I bought from and on the advice of Andrews Cameras, Teddington, when I suddenly found myself called upon to have a digital camera for a Cubs project, in 2008 or so. I may even have the manual somewhere...

 

It is ideal for wagon photography since with it sitting flat either on the cutting mat or butting up to the edge thereof, the subject is roughly in the middle (vertically) of the photo.

 

Posted photos are compressed to 1024 x 768 pixels and cropped top and bottom to a multiple of 20 pixels, with the 8 coming off the top, because that's how I am.

Edited July 23, 2023 by Compound2632