Top Gear?

[MJI]

The R2 demographic hasn't changed, it's just that the Stranglers and Nirvana fans have aged into it

 

Mr Evans, ably assisted by the equally dreadful Vanessa Feltz, propelled me into an easy transition to Radios 4 and 6 throughout the morning. The only exception being if I'm in the car (where I don't have DAB so can't get R6) when I occasionally tune in to Ken Bruce or one of the stand-in presenters if either of the "terrible two" are off. 

 

John

 

For me independant local radio until the huge merging, when they all became the same, Then our ILR disappeared.

 

So now BBC local, a CD, or peace and quiet

[EddieB]

Well I watched episode 2 on iPlayer (though in truth I skipped most of it), because I was interested in the route through KZN and Lesotho.

 

Contrived?  Well take a "star" with an over-inflated ego, who "entertained" at the FA Cup Final  and two performers dredged from the mire of obscurity (though I suspect some here may have heard of them) and it was always clear who would be headlining on the bill for the punters at the bar in Lesotho.  Rest of it was trying to recreate a formula that worked in the past.  At least with C, M and H the contrivances were believable.

[Adrian]

performers dredged from the mire of obscurity (though I suspect some here may have heard of them) 

 

 

Hardly dredged up from the mire of obscurity - they are still hugely popular. That said though, they probably got the gig being best buddies of Chris Evans, they both appear regularly at his CarFest concerts.

[jjb1970]

I think the TG review in the current issue of Private Eye has hit the nail on the head, well worth a read.

[The Fatadder]

Evans - still far too shouty, voiceover still very flat

 

Star in a rally cross car, the replacement of the interview is awful, I disliked the old segment but this is a hundred times worse (plus since when has it been the bbc's job to promote a show on Sky...)

 

Jenson Button was very good in the mclaren section, given it looks like he won't have a drive next year maybe he could replace Evans....

 

Eddie Jordan manages to almost do the impossible and make Evans almost watchable, cringingly bad!

 

I did like the idea of the South Africa tour, and it would have worked very well with the old 3. But with these 3 (and the pointless addition of 'celebrities') it just didn't quite cut it. Really like the look of the Jag, I started wanting to hate it and ended thinking that it's found its way onto the shortlist for our next car.

[Huw Griffiths]

Contrived? Well take a "star" with an over-inflated ego, who "entertained" at the FA Cup Final and two performers dredged from the mire of obscurity (though I suspect some here may have heard of them) and it was always clear who would be headlining on the bill for the punters at the bar in Lesotho. Rest of it was trying to recreate a formula that worked in the past. At least with C, M and H the contrivances were believable.

Either that, or a lot of regular viewers had come to expect them as a bit of a running joke - the only rules seemed to be that the tall, brash, 50-something always won. It didn't matter how many rules he had to break (or change as he went along), the tall, brash, 50-something always won.

 

Fast forward to 2016 - there's a different tall, brash, 50-something in town - and, apparently, the same joke suddenly ceases to be funny. Throw in a 60-something with a F1 background (and suggestions of "alternative" interpretations of the rules) and some people appear to be up in arms. I'm not.

 

 

Hardly dredged up from the mire of obscurity - they are still hugely popular. That said though, they probably got the gig being best buddies of Chris Evans, they both appear regularly at his CarFest concerts.

Probably not a bad thing, in all honesty.

 

After a certain gentleman "suddenly became un-busy", any replacement was always likely to take some time to get established - longer to get accepted by a large audience - and probably forever to get accepted by really loyal viewers of the previous version.

 

It's inevitable that the new version of TopGear is going to feature a lot of experimentation - trying stuff out - trying out ways of doing stuff. Some things might not work first time - but a lot probably will.

 

Certainly though, I suspect that, if anyone's able to make this lot work, Chris Evans is probably more capable than most. He isn't to everyone's liking, but he doesn't need to be - he's there to do a job - to deliver change where it's needed, while keeping enough people watching during the time the programmes are on the BBC website. It doesn't matter if these viewers are the same people who used to tune in to see "the 3 amigos".

 

However, it makes sense if Chris Evans is able to test a lot of the new stuff out, using people he knows - people who are already used to working with him.

 

 

It's possible to fall into the trap of comparing the current team and the current programme with the Clarkson era. Here's a newsflash, guys - Mr. Clarkson is a very talented journalist, but he's not on TopGear any longer - and he's not coming back any time soon.

 

If you're looking for exactly the same show, presented in exactly the same way, by exactly the same team, you were always going to be disappointed. I'm not.

 

I don't see this show as the "Clarkson Roadshow". In fact, I'm more interested in a different question: "Is this an enjoyable show - a show that I find worth watching and look forward to watching?"

 

For me, THIS is the question that matters - for me, the answer so far is a very emphatic YES.

 

You might agree with me - you might not - but everyone's entitled to their own opinion.

 

 

And on that bombshell - sorry, we don't do that any more.

 

Thank you for reading. Goodnight.

Edited June 11, 2016 by Huw Griffiths

[RJS1977]

 

It's possible to fall into the trap of comparing the current team and the current programme with the Clarkson era. Here's a newsflash, guys - Mr. Clarkson is a very talented journalist, but he's not on TopGear any longer - and he's not coming back any time soon.

 

 

Quite- I think whenever a well-established and successful presenter or actor is replaced, there will be inevitable negative comparisons (qv Lazenby/Moore replacing Connery*, Ed Tudor-Pole replacing Richard O'Brien and probably Troughton replacing Hartnell) It doesn't necessarily mean the replacement is any better/worse than what went before, just different,

 

*As someone who grew up in the Moore era, Roger Moore *was* Bond for me so naturally my first impressions of Timothy Dalton were negative ones. But with hindsight I now find I enjoy both RM's and TD's interpretations, in different ways.

[peanuts]

I don't see this show as the "Clarkson Roadshow". In fact, I'm more interested in a different question: "Is this an enjoyable show - a show that I find worth watching and look forward to watching?"

For me, THIS is the question that matters - for me, the answer so far is a very emphatic YES.

 

That is the question for me is it not the remit of the BBC  to entertain and inform ? so far watching both programmes i have been just that job done 

[Arthur]

If you're looking for exactly the same show, presented in exactly the same way, by exactly the same team, you were always going to be disappointed.

 

But therein lies the problem. I doubt many were looking for the same show, presented the same way, by this new lot. As I have said repeatedly, the biggest mistake Evans and the new team could have made was to make a show along similar lines to the old show. That was just never going to work. But that is just, so far, what they have done. It's a pastiche of the CHM show format and immediately garners unfavourable comparison.

 

CE and the new team needed to develop, just as CHM did, their own unique take on the show and to thrive or wither with their own creation.

 

I'm warming to Le Blanc as a presenter. I thought he seemed a bit subdued in episode 1, and was a bit surprised by that, but the more I see of him the more I'm liking him. As for CE, the more I......., well, you get the picture.

 

 

.

Edited June 11, 2016 by Arthur

[bertiedog]

Interestingly It is being said by an insider or two, that Clarkson and the others are not quite happy with Amazon, as the new deal covered a long period, and lots of programs, all at Clarksons and the others cost, perhaps even leaving less income than the Beeb contract.

 

They are paying for everything, and even some car makers who would have supplied the BBC have refused utterly to supply to the new show, so far. A  company or two have been set up by the boys to contain costs, but they did expect Amazon to stump up cash for the production team, writers etc., and offices, none of which has come in as yet.

 

It is not beyond belief that Clarkson may return to Top Gear after a couple of years with Matt Leblanc in charge, there are plenty of people at the BBC who support his way of presenting, and as he broke no contracts or agreements he would be no problem to ease back in in future.

 

Some people cannot wait for the new show, but Amazon admit the take up so far for new viewers is poor in the UK, and they never reveal viewing figures anyway. It depends so much on the advertisers buying the advert time around the net based show, and advertisers prefer ITV etc rather than the vague and woolly net advert income.

 

The show will open, and expect fireworks from them! but will it last the course?

 

Stephen.

[edcayton]

Yes, but it isn't a "new" Top Gear at all really, is it? It is the same format that developed with C,H and M as the presenters. This became absolutely brilliant unmissable TV (catch John Bishop's "best of"), but after several years became tired, and in need of a re-vamp. 

 

Unfortunately (deliberately?) circumstances led to the presenting team leaving the show. I don't know how much of the format was down to these guys, and how much to those that remain.

 

But the BBC have decided in their wisdom to keep flogging the dead horse in the same way that VW tried to keep air-cooled rear engined cars beyond their sell-buy date. They chose a presentation team that has split opinion. In my view the worst aspects of the new show have been the start-"tonight I shout a lot and X has a poo" and the end-"and on that bomb shell.....we don't do that any more".

 

I will carry on watching TG despite Evans because it's the only car show on the BBC now. They could save themselves a great deal of money by using different presenters (look at any number on YouTube). The second show was a great deal better than the first and the Extra Gear show is probably better than TG.    

 

My son has Amazon Prime, so I will be able to watch The Grand Tour. The title suggests it may not all be cars, this may be for the better. I bet Clarkson and co are looking on with interest.

 

Ed

 

BTW, I will never pay for extra TV channels, still less so if they insult me by carrying advertising too.

Edited June 11, 2016 by edcayton

[PaulCheffus]

It's possible to fall into the trap of comparing the current team and the current programme with the Clarkson era. Here's a newsflash, guys - Mr. Clarkson is a very talented journalist, but he's not on TopGear any longer - and he's not coming back any time soon.

If you're looking for exactly the same show, presented in exactly the same way, by exactly the same team, you were always going to be disappointed. I'm not.

 

Hi

 

I would agree but what has been produced as far as I am concerned is a weak imitation of the original which doesn't work. They needed to go back to basics and start again with a completely different format.

 

Cheers

 

Paul

[MJI]

Problems are multiple

 

1) Trying to keep the old WCMH formula, it had to change, would have to have changed with WCMH anyway.

 

2) CE is more devisive than JC, JC is actually a good journalist playing the buffoon. CE is Haribo on legs.

There are more people who are not JC fans who are tolerant of him than CE. But CE fans do tend to like him a lot.

[Edwardian]

JC is actually a good journalist playing the buffoon.

 

Yes, he is. He has a genuine knowledge and love of his subject and is a good journalist.  He is also a very good presenter. 

 

I don't have to feel comfortable with all sides of his, doubtless, complex personality, or agree with everything he says on or off camera, to have enjoyed his performance, along with that of his co-presenters, on TG for many years.

 

Also, I have to say, I do not accept the logic of the Beeb's position.  His TG contract has gone, but they give him other jobs. I don't want to re-open a can of worms, but I would have thought that no-Clarkson-on-anything for a period,  say a year, as part of whatever disciplinary/settlement would  have been better.  What is the logic of a position that says "we disapprove of what Clarkson has done and we cannot be associated with it, so he will no longer present TG, but we will, of course, hire him to present HIGNFY"?

 

I would have thought some sort of meaningful across the board suspension followed by repentant rehabilitation, e.g. Jonathan Ross.  Frankly I found the latter's act  of calculated cruelty more egregious than Clarkson's petulant out-burst, bad though that was.

 

More's to the point, I think with this new TG series, the public has been punished enough!

[Guest]

CE is Haribo on legs.

 

?

But Haribo is yummy!

[Guest]

What is the logic of a position that says "we disapprove of what Clarkson has done and we cannot be associated with it, so he will no longer present TG, but we will, of course, hire him to present HIGNFY"?

 

It's not so closely coupled as that. The BBC buy in HIGNFY. Top Hat who make it hired JC to present it.

[Butler Henderson]

Well worth watching the latest Extra Gear on iplayer, Eddie Jordan comes across far differently, Chris Evans is better being interviewed rather interviewing and the audience genuinely seemed to find bits funny.

[metropolitan cammell]

What do people think of extra gear on bbc 3, I watched last weeks episode and thought Roy Reid and Chris Harris where good, enthusatic and funny.

[jjb1970]

What do people think of extra gear on bbc 3, I watched last weeks episode and thought Roy Reid and Chris Harris where good, enthusatic and funny.

In a way this is the big problem facing TG and Chris Evans, to date just about everybody I know who watched the show has said Extra Gear is excellent whilst the main show is a poor copy of the old show. A pretty sad indictment of the main show when the BBC3 spin off is considered to be a much better show.

[Phil Parker]

But therein lies the problem. I doubt many were looking for the same show, presented the same way, by this new lot. As I have said repeatedly, the biggest mistake Evans and the new team could have made was to make a show along similar lines to the old show. That was just never going to work. But that is just, so far, what they have done. It's a pastiche of the CHM show format and immediately garners unfavourable comparison.

 

CE and the new team needed to develop, just as CHM did, their own unique take on the show and to thrive or wither with their own creation.

 

I'm warming to Le Blanc as a presenter. I thought he seemed a bit subdued in episode 1, and was a bit surprised by that, but the more I see of him the more I'm liking him. As for CE, the more I......., well, you get the picture.

 

 

I think a lot of the loudest and fastest complainants WERE only interested in a JC fronted show. He could sit on the toilet for an hour and they would declare it the greatest TV ever made. New TG had no chance of keeping them happy no matter what it did. As you say, it needs to be allowed to develop into something new. It might even be that CE is a bit of a sacrificial lamb in that he can easily be shoved of to another project once the rest of the team bed in, but for the moment he is both the big name to keep sales going, and someone who can draw fire away from the others.

 

The solution is my instalation as King. Once in the big house, I'll quickly have ownership of BMWs made a capital crime (possibly big Audis too) and then move on to requiring anyone who wants to drive a powerful car to drive a Caterham for a year first. By the end of this, you can either drive, or are wrapped around a tree. Those JC lovers who think good driving involves pushing the "loud pedal" down hard and bellowing "POWER!!!!" will be in the second group. Twitter will be a lot quieter.

 

(I once overtook a Subrau in the snow in my 206. He had burried his foot in the floor and the car wheels were spinning to no effect. I cruised by him hoping to pass before he started rotating sideways)

 

In the meantime, I am not bothered about JC shows and have no desire to own an Amazon Prime. I'd be sorry to see no more James May shows on the BBC though. He has a very sensible attitude to spanner organisation.

[Edwardian]

It's not so closely coupled as that. The BBC buy in HIGNFY. Top Hat who make it hired JC to present it.

 

Yes, but the effect is still Jezza on the Beeb, which makes the Beeb's stance look ridiculous. 

[MJI]

 

The solution is my instalation as King. Once in the big house, I'll quickly have ownership of BMWs made a capital crime (possibly big Audis too) and then move on to requiring anyone who wants to drive a powerful car to drive a Caterham for a year first. By the end of this, you can either drive, or are wrapped around a tree. Those JC lovers who think good driving involves pushing the "loud pedal" down hard and bellowing "POWER!!!!" will be in the second group. Twitter will be a lot quieter.

 

 

That is his act, the POWER shouting.

 

It is obviously not the real person but a caricature

[MJI]

(I once overtook a Subrau in the snow in my 206. He had burried his foot in the floor and the car wheels were spinning to no effect. I cruised by him hoping to pass before he started rotating sideways)

 

I once beat a Porsche along a twisty road in a Chrysler Sunbeam, same car also dealt with some pretty quick cars on the same road.

[MJI]

Yes, he is. He has a genuine knowledge and love of his subject and is a good journalist.  He is also a very good presenter. 

 

I don't have to feel comfortable with all sides of his, doubtless, complex personality, or agree with everything he says on or off camera, to have enjoyed his performance, along with that of his co-presenters, on TG for many years.

 

Also, I have to say, I do not accept the logic of the Beeb's position.  His TG contract has gone, but they give him other jobs. I don't want to re-open a can of worms, but I would have thought that no-Clarkson-on-anything for a period,  say a year, as part of whatever disciplinary/settlement would  have been better.  What is the logic of a position that says "we disapprove of what Clarkson has done and we cannot be associated with it, so he will no longer present TG, but we will, of course, hire him to present HIGNFY"?

 

I would have thought some sort of meaningful across the board suspension followed by repentant rehabilitation, e.g. Jonathan Ross.  Frankly I found the latter's act  of calculated cruelty more egregious than Clarkson's petulant out-burst, bad though that was.

 

More's to the point, I think with this new TG series, the public has been punished enough!

 

He was not actually sacked, he was just not renewed for TG.

 

JC can annoy me, but you can tell it is an act and not real.

 

TG is now a poor quality fan version of earlier TG.

 

They should have changed the set, the Senator seats, the V12 block table, the wrecked cars from WCMH era.

 

The keeping of so much WCMH stuff, reminds you this is really their show and not the current crew.

 

I have seen lots of UK motoring shows and the amount of really good motoring presenters is quite small.

 

JC is without a doubt one of the best, other good ones are Tiff Needel, and due to WCMH, JM and RH.

 

Average, Count Quentula is to be honest really a S/H car sales show presenter, was not bad on early shows, but to be honest better off trying to test older cars for boring shows, than excite people, Vicky 506 was good at first but got a little tiring after a while. Tom Ford also OK, good but a bit forgetable.

 

Not good are

 

Gene Hunt chap, very false in places, obvious disinterest at some cars, CE simply because he is CE, marmite flavoured Haribo.

 

One to watch (if they dumped CE)

 

Matt Leblanc

Edited June 11, 2016 by MJI

[MJI]

Car shows in general.

 

One thing people forget is that if I want to know what an average boring car is like, I can test one, I go to the dealer and take a test drive.

 

Now how do a get a test drive in the latest McClaren?