Castle Aching

[Nearholmer]

Hell’s Teeth! That was quick!

[wagonman]

You have my sympathies, SEM. I recently used the 'net to try to find out something about Llandinam Bridge, which has a connection to David Davies of railway contracting, Ocean Coal Company and Barry Railway fame. Fortunately I knew the basics and wanted to check on the spelling of a name, as I found four different versions of the story only one of which was correct - the "best" stated that the bridge had been built for the industrialist DD to give him access to his house. The fact is that it was built when he was still a farmer and it was his first ever civil engineering contract, as he had been spotted by the County Surveyor, Penson. And it was only a small part of the contract, not the bridge itself. Even the Welsh government site had it wrong. So never trust the 'net for research.

Mind you don't trust books either. I was upbraided about the first article I ever wrote, in which I said something gleaned from one of the respected authors on the subject, only to be told that it was wrong. And there is a photo of two Rhymney Railway carriages which has been published several times with an incorrect caption.

Unfortunately, not all of us can spend time at York etc doing that primary research and have to rely on the work of others.

Also, remember that history is written by the winners. Ask the losers and you will get a different version. Of course neither may be correct.

Or to be safe, write your own, as we do here.

Jonathan

 

 

Just to rub salt in the wounds, even primary sources can be wrong sometimes – errors ranging from a slip of the pen to intentional mendacity.

 

Like you say – best to make up your own history!   :-0

[RedGemAlchemist]

Just to rub salt in the wounds, even primary sources can be wrong sometimes – errors ranging from a slip of the pen to intentional mendacity.

 

Like you say – best to make up your own history! :-0

Exactly. da Vinci was so paranoid about his research and designs getting into unscrupulous hands that he coded them, wrote them in mirror writing AND added deliberate errors, sometimes all at the same time! We still don't know what a good deal of what he actually wrote is because you try decoding something written and coded by arguably the smartest man who ever lived quickly. Edited December 12, 2018 by RedGemAlchemist

[corneliuslundie]

And never believe official drawings either, only what was actually produced in the works and was photographed - but not the liveries, especially for certain wagon builders.

Re the phaeton, the actual drawing is in he same style as the GWR officials it came with and has a drawing number. I therefore am reasonably confident it emanated from Swindon or Stafford Road, and it is described on the drawing as a mail phaeton. Perhaps for extremely urgent but light items? The boss's missives?

Jonathan

[Edwardian]

And never believe official drawings either, only what was actually produced in the works and was photographed - but not the liveries, especially for certain wagon builders.

Re the phaeton, the actual drawing is in he same style as the GWR officials it came with and has a drawing number. I therefore am reasonably confident it emanated from Swindon or Stafford Road, and it is described on the drawing as a mail phaeton. Perhaps for extremely urgent but light items? The boss's missives?

Jonathan

 

Whatever their origins, they were sporty numbers, for gentlemen who wanted to drive themselves.  The internal combustion equivalent is a 2+2 roadster, as opposed to the Board Room on wheels one's chauffeur drives. 

 

I assume this is Lord Erstwhile's, or his son's.   

[Guy Rixon]

 doubt if the post would arrive in anything like that, there's no storage room, and the driver and his companion occupied the front seats with the hood to keep off the rain, whilst the groom clung onto the rails around the back seat, keeping the back end down on bumpy stretches, getting wet and muddy.  The semi-circular cut-out abaft the driving seat is to allow the front wheels to turn at right-angles for tight turns.

 

Wikipedia: "The most impressive phaeton was the English four-wheeled high flyer. The mail and spider phaetons were more conservatively constructed. The mail phaeton was used chiefly to carry passengers with luggage and was named for its construction, using "mail" springs originally designed for use on mail coaches"

[DonB]

Quote-" i think it is GWR and dates from the last decade of the nineteenth century. Whatever the source, it cries out to be modelled. I imagine though that the design is pretty generic.

Two interesting things: the "gauge" is 4 ft 2 in,; and the "horizontal" lines on which the wheels sit are a few inches apart. I am not sure what that signifies, other than that it would not have sat level."

 

the above quote re. the Mail Phaeton ,  the rear springing could have been "softer" than at the front end, or so designed that when fully loaded, with people or goods, the weight at the back would result in a level ride. Not that there was much chance of smooth ride on the roads (turnpikes?)in 1903. Potholes are currently trying to emulate the 19xx conditions!

 

edit, Guy beat me to the punch!

Edited December 12, 2018 by DonB

[Edwardian]

Mail Phaetons ..... 

[RedGemAlchemist]

Mail Phaetons .....

Honestly? It looks like a pram to me.

[DonB]

Honestly? It looks like a pram to me.

PRAM indeed!  tut tut.....

 

As a proud parent, I pushed our High Perambulator miles around the village. 

[corneliuslundie]

Which leaves the question as to why the GWR would want to build one. Interesting. but it would still make a nice model for the local lord, Erstwhile or otherwise.

Jonathan

[RedGemAlchemist]

PRAM indeed! tut tut.....

 

...Perambulator...

Toh-may-toes tom-ah-toes. Edited December 12, 2018 by RedGemAlchemist

[Martin S-C]

A Mail Phaeton?  Sexy.

 

Like this one (still in the Castle Aching paint shop)....?

That's a nice model. Is it a commercial kit? If so, who makes it, please.

[uax6]

The stepped drawing shows the half sections of the frond and rear axles, the front being lower as it incorporates the turntable for the frond axle to steer. Its lower as its infinitely easier to draw the body on a straight horizontal line, than to have it at a slope across the page, throwing out all the vertical lines. When assembled the drivers seat is higher, but the springs are arranged to allow the body to become level when the driver climbs up....

 

Now heres a question: The Parish Church of Hilgay in West Norfolk has got much evidence of being gas lit (the pipework is all in, as are the bases of the wall burners, just the bats wings missing), but the village is small, and as far as I know never had a Gasworks. Would the Church have had a small gas producer plant? Seems very odd if it did....

 

Andy G

[Nearholmer]

Carbide or acetylene? Made by dripping water into a powder that could be bought from pharmacists.

 

Good write-up here https://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/documents/the-argory---historic-lighting.pdf

 

Plant in the write-up and below is fairly large - there were smaller set-ups, about the size/shape of a 55 gallon oil drum.

Edited December 12, 2018 by Nearholmer

[uax6]

I had never even thought about it being anything other than Town gas, and now it makes much more sense, although I'm still surprised that a Parish Church went to all the expense.

 

Looks very compact, I have to say. I'll have to see if I can find some of the village oldies to see what they remember about it.

 

Ta

 

Andy G

[TheQ]

This is a pram

 

Dinghy...

[Compound2632]

Carbide or acetylene? Made by dripping water into a powder that could be bought from pharmacists.

 

Good write-up here https://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/documents/the-argory---historic-lighting.pdf

 

Plant in the write-up and below is fairly large - there were smaller set-ups, about the size/shape of a 55 gallon oil drum.

 

The carriages of the Lynton & Barnstaple railway were illuminated by such a system - there was a box on the end of each carriage that housed the apparatus. It must have been the latest thing, since I read the technology was perfected in 1892, only six years before the L&B opened.

[webbcompound]

The carriages of the Lynton & Barnstaple railway were illuminated by such a system - there was a box on the end of each carriage that housed the apparatus. It must have been the latest thing, since I read the technology was perfected in 1892, only six years before the L&B opened.

The problem with Acetyline is that in the right conditions it can decompose explosively. As a result its use (apart from in welding) is now limited except in certain health and safety light regimes (such as the UK if we go into post Brexit freefall). Blowback into the containing cylinder is always a problem if the correct procedures are not followed, and I can remember having these drilled into me when I was being trained in the use of back-pack oxy-acetyline cutting equipment.

[Hroth]

This is a pram

port1-600x400.jpg

 

Dinghy...

That there is a praam dinghy....

 

Praam is (I am told) a Dutch word for a small flat bottomed boat.  Dinghy, on the other hand is a word hailing from the Indian subcontinent meaning a small boat.

 

Makes you proud to speak English, eh?

[Hroth]

The problem with Acetyline is that in the right conditions it can decompose explosively. As a result its use (apart from in welding) is now limited except in certain health and safety light regimes (such as the UK if we go into post Brexit freefall). Blowback into the containing cylinder is always a problem if the correct procedures are not followed, and I can remember having these drilled into me when I was being trained in the use of back-pack oxy-acetyline cutting equipment.

 

Does that apply only to stored Acetylene, ie in gas cylinders?

 

I would have thought that an Acetylene generator, producing gas at slightly above ambient air pressure from a solid source wouldn't be so dangerous?

Of course, Acetylene lighting is an obsolete technology and there was a rather more relaxed attitude to safety back then!

 

Even so, the Railway Inspectorate were fighting a battle with the railway companies to ditch the highly dangerous Pintsch gas carriage lighting systems for electric lighting.

[Talltim]

"Everything you need to know is on the internet" If I gave my honest opiinion of that statement I would be banned strait away, so I will be polite rubbish!

But what happens if the thing I needed to know was what your opinion was?

[Talltim]

Edison borrowed? A "Lightbulb" moment....

Didn’t you know? He was only four inches tall and live behind the fuse box...

[Nearholmer]

The explosive decomposition products of acetylene can arise within the pipework. Which isn’t really very good!

[Andy Hayter]

Acetylene 101:

 

Is formed by dripping water onto lump calcium carbide.  Calcium Carbide is derived by heating limestone and coke in an arc furnace.  Because neither the limestone nor the coke are particularly pure you do not get the pure white powder of pure calcium carbide.

 

Acetylene in contact with copper metal forms explosive copper acetylide (copper carbide).  Copper is therefore not used in acetylene lamps where it comes into contact with the gas.

Acetylene can also spontaneously decompose (explosively) at above 5 bar.  Cylinders therefore contain the gas dissolved under pressure in acetone (or other solvent), where the decomposition does not occur.

 

An acetylene lamp contains two chambers one above the other.  The lower chamber holds the lump calcium carbide.  The upper cylinder is a water reservoir.  Between the two is a needle valve that allows the water to drip onto the carbide and generate the gas.  This exits the lower chamber through a nozzle where the gas is ignited and then continues to burn for as long as the water and carbide supplies remain and the needle valve remains open.  Excess pressure in the lower chamber can occur if the burner nozzle becomes blocked (and on smaller models they do) but can never exceed the 5 bar safety since excess gas escapes through the needle valve and out through the water chamber - which is vented, firstly to provide this escape, but more importantly to avoid the water chamber ending in negative pressure as the water flows out.  This would stop the flow of water.

 

Acetylene lighting has been used for lamps on steam locomotives, early lighting of motor vehicles and latterly by potholers - which is why I know so much about them.  It provides an intense white light.