Castle Aching

[Edwardian]

Meanwhile, back in 1905, it seems sufficient for my limited purposes to note that there is a difference between a SPAD and a SPAR.

 

(though, for me, that was never in doubt)

[TheQ]

Difficult SPAR wasn't created till 1932.

 

But I can see many spars on that aircraft

Edited October 5, 2017 by TheQ

[Edwardian]

Difficult SPAR wasn't created till 1932.

 

But I can see many spars on that arircraft

 

I think the point is that neither are relevant.

 

Not that this has traditionally been a concern or limitation to this topic, mind you ....

Edited October 5, 2017 by Edwardian

[Compound2632]

Relevance, relevance...

 

Way back when I used C&L components, I used their butatone to bond chairs to plastic sleepers - strong enough. My understanding is that it also works for ply sleepers, although with plastic to plastic one has a true welded joint - the action of the solvent results in a breakdown of the surface layer of the plastic. I can see that the plastic my flow into the structure of the ply but do wonder how strong the joint is between these dissimilar materials.

 

Way back they used to speak of ply and rivet construction, in which the rail is soldered to metal inserts (rivets) in the sleepers, and the chairs are purely for decoration.

[Edwardian]

butatone ...  My understanding is that it also works for ply sleepers ... the action of the solvent results in a breakdown of the surface layer of the plastic. I can see that the plastic might flow into the structure of the ply ....

 

So I am given to understand

[Edwardian]

I am now in possession of methylethyl ketone

 

Trippy!

[Compound2632]

I am now in possession of methylethyl ketone

 

Trippy!

 

The point at which the rest of the family at least will appreciate the railway being in the outhouse.

[nick_bastable]

I am now in possession of methylethyl ketone

 

Trippy!

 

 

Nick

[Edwardian]

 

 

Nick

 

 

I would hope that point construction presents no more than a two pipe problem, rather than one requiring a seven percent solution ...

[Hroth]

I suspect that Holmes displaying his patriotic credentials through gunfire were a side effect of the 7% solution.....

[Nearholmer]

My experience of MEK is that it yields a seriously, seriously bad, thumping headache, rather than any form of psychedelic experience, but I confess to not having tried it intravenously.

 

It's actually not very nice stuff, as this indicates http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9927358

[Hroth]

My experience of MEK is that it yields a seriously, seriously bad, thumping headache, rather than any form of psychedelic experience, but I confess to not having tried it intravenously.

 

It's actually not very nice stuff, as this indicates http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9927358

Eeep!!!

 

"Houston, we have a problem..."

 

Of course it's a US version of a COSHH sheet.  Seek Medical Attention, Seek Medical Attention, Seek.....

 

European ones only suggest mandate getting medical aid once some has been swallowed or its got onto the eye. Otherwise wash it off.   Its serious stuff though, gloves and protective clothes and eyewear are definitely indicated.  Better invest in a good old fashioned labcoat!  At least the room Edwardian intends to use it in appears to be "well ventilated".

 

http://www.holmberg.se/upload/product/files/sds-methyl-ethyl-ketone-mek-eng-2014-08-19---733.pdf

 

Edit to ensure that I'm taking H&S seriously for once.

Edited October 5, 2017 by Hroth

[Old Gringo]

Meanwhile, back in 1905, it seems sufficient for my limited purposes to note that there is a difference between a SPAD and a SPAR.

 

(though, for me, that was never in doubt)

 

Having been a 'lurker' on this topic ever since the start and enjoyed all the discussions, superb modelling and the unusual diversions, I have at last found an entry upon which I can add a (possibly) worthwhile contribution to.  That is not just any old Spad pictured in post 5682.

 

Spotting the mark of the "Hat in the Ring" (94th, U.S. Aero) Squadron on the fuselage, it had me checking to see if it was the Spad X111 of American Ace, Eddie Rickenbacker  - and it is the plane in which he made many of his 26 confirmed victories between April and October 1918.  A mechanic and racing driver before WW1, Rickenbacker first flew the Spad in June, when the 94th was equipped with these excellent machines and he would return to the U.S.A. a national hero.

 

"He had two loves, automobiles and aircraft, and he split his subsequent career between the two; launching the Rickenbacker Motor Company in 1921, but later joining General Motors in 1928 and then Eastern Airlines in 1935". (Information from "Aces and Aircraft of World War 1", Christopher Campbell, 1981, p133>)

 

Hope you don't mind the intrusion and yet another diversion on your entertaining topic.

 

Every success with the layout.

John.

[mullie]

My experience of MEK is that it yields a seriously, seriously bad, thumping headache, rather than any form of psychedelic experience, but I confess to not having tried it intravenously.

 

It's actually not very nice stuff, as this indicates http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9927358

Some of us can't even contemplate using such stuff, I also no longer use oil based paint because of the fumes. As someone who has built PCB point work for the last ten years I wonder if there is a low fume alternative so I too can build detailed pointwork.

 

As detailed on my own threads I'm changing to EM so need to find a low fume way of fixing chairs to sleepers when building point work, anyone found any alternatives to butanone?

 

Martyn

[Talltim]

Going off topic (yeah, I know) but I couldn't think of a more apposite group of people to share this with.

Cathedral Twitter wars

https://mobile.twitter.com/StPaulsLondon/status/914859532639260672

[uax6]

I would have through superglue would be a good alternative, its widely used on plastics, and I regularly glue plastics to the table with it.....

 

Andy G

[Shadow]

Not as far off topic as you think with that Twitter link!

 

Was having a look through and came across this picture of Lincoln Cathedral.

 

 

What's with the pyramid too the left of the Cathedral?

[TheQ]

I believe thats the roof of the Chapter house that is part of the cathedral, it's height is exagerated by the angle of the picture

 

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Lincoln/@53.2347252,-0.5362654,284m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x48780ccb711104fb:0x36603dcfe8c7ddc7!8m2!3d53.230688!4d-0.540579

 

The round one top right in this picture.

 

Chapter house,  a building for meetings which is normally round or octagonal with seats round the edge facing in so the monks could see each other when talking.

[Nearholmer]

Whow!

 

That is both beautiful, and a brilliant illustration of the power of the church in medieval times. You'd need to be mad, very brave, or Henry VIII to mess with an institution that could collar the resources to build that.

 

K

[TheQ]

Whow!

 

That is both beautiful, and a brilliant illustration of the power of the church in medieval times. You'd need to be mad, very brave, or Henry VIII to mess with an institution that could collar the resources to build that.

 

K

1/10 of everything anyone produced, plus owning vast tracts of land worked for you by the lay brothers for food and keep only, serfs for free,  plenty of spar spare money.

[Edwardian]

My experience of MEK is that it yields a seriously, seriously bad, thumping headache, rather than any form of psychedelic experience, but I confess to not having tried it intravenously.

 

It's actually not very nice stuff, as this indicates http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9927358

 

Eeep!!!

 

"Houston, we have a problem..."

 

Of course it's a US version of a COSHH sheet.  Seek Medical Attention, Seek Medical Attention, Seek.....

 

European ones only suggest mandate getting medical aid once some has been swallowed or its got onto the eye. Otherwise wash it off.   Its serious stuff though, gloves and protective clothes and eyewear are definitely indicated.  Better invest in a good old fashioned labcoat!  At least the room Edwardian intends to use it in appears to be "well ventilated".

 

http://www.holmberg.se/upload/product/files/sds-methyl-ethyl-ketone-mek-eng-2014-08-19---733.pdf

 

Edit to ensure that I'm taking H&S seriously for once.

 

Thank you, gentlemen.  I will read this material with interest and concern.

 

 

Having been a 'lurker' on this topic ever since the start and enjoyed all the discussions, superb modelling and the unusual diversions, I have at last found an entry upon which I can add a (possibly) worthwhile contribution to.  That is not just any old Spad pictured in post 5682.

 

Spotting the mark of the "Hat in the Ring" (94th, U.S. Aero) Squadron on the fuselage, it had me checking to see if it was the Spad X111 of American Ace, Eddie Rickenbacker  - and it is the plane in which he made many of his 26 confirmed victories between April and October 1918.  A mechanic and racing driver before WW1, Rickenbacker first flew the Spad in June, when the 94th was equipped with these excellent machines and he would return to the U.S.A. a national hero.

 

"He had two loves, automobiles and aircraft, and he split his subsequent career between the two; launching the Rickenbacker Motor Company in 1921, but later joining General Motors in 1928 and then Eastern Airlines in 1935". (Information from "Aces and Aircraft of World War 1", Christopher Campbell, 1981, p133>)

 

Hope you don't mind the intrusion and yet another diversion on your entertaining topic.

 

Every success with the layout.

John.

 

Thank you, John, for making yourself known, and such interesting contributions are always very welcome. Please chip in as and when.

 

I believe that SPADs were used by the British, American and Italian airforces in addition to the French.  Not that au fait with the various types and who flew them, so that was all new to me.  What a fascinating 'fella.

 

One of my wife's forebears (from the Anglo-Irish rather than the Cornish branch) was a RFC fighter ace.  I can't imagine what such an experience was like and the rate of loss was truly horrific. 

 

Not as far off topic as you think with that Twitter link!

 

Was having a look through and came across this picture of Lincoln Cathedral.

 

DLJT84EW0AAhb3u.jpg

 

What's with the pyramid too the left of the Cathedral?

 

 

I believe thats the roof of the Chapter house that is part of the cathedral, it's height is exagerated by the angle of the picture

 

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Lincoln/@53.2347252,-0.5362654,284m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x48780ccb711104fb:0x36603dcfe8c7ddc7!8m2!3d53.230688!4d-0.540579

 

The round one top right in this picture.

 

Chapter house,  a building for meetings which is normally round or octagonal with seats round the edge facing in so the monks could see each other when talking.

 

My first thought was that it is either the Illuminati or the result of a sales drive by the Metropolitan Pyramid Company. 

 

But, the Q is quite right, it appears to be the chapter house.  Then again, my first guess was not too wide of the mark, as I believe that it was used as a location for the execrable Da Vinci Code.

 

 

Whow!

 

That is both beautiful, and a brilliant illustration of the power of the church in medieval times. You'd need to be mad, very brave, or Henry VIII to mess with an institution that could collar the resources to build that.

 

K

 

True.  But as Henry VIII realised, having substantial assets can make you a vulnerable target.

[Compound2632]

But, the Q is quite right, it appears to be the chapter house.  Then again, my first guess was not too wide of the mark, as I believe that it was used as a location for the execrable Da Vinci Code..

 

It's pupped!

[Anglian]

Such was Eddie Rickenbacker's fame that a guitar making company, previously known as Rickenbacher, adjusted one letter in their name to become all American. 

[Nearholmer]

Being a dimbo when it came to history at school, it's taken me forever to realise what a genius Henry VIII was. Aside from his other accomplishments, going for a pincer movement on the church, tackling doctrine/theology simultaneous with tackling temporal power was strategically very clever. Exploiting the climate of the times to do it was smart too; if he'd hesitated for too long, things mightn't have gone the way they did.

 

Now back towards topic ....... oops, can't think of anything relevant!

[Regularity]

Some of us can't even contemplate using such stuff, I also no longer use oil based paint because of the fumes. As someone who has built PCB point work for the last ten years I wonder if there is a low fume alternative so I too can build detailed pointwork.

 

As detailed on my own threads I'm changing to EM so need to find a low fume way of fixing chairs to sleepers when building point work, anyone found any alternatives to butanone?

 

Martyn

It depends partly on how you wish to make your points.

 

You could use the old ply and rivet system, and apply the chairs cosmetically (first cutting them in half) using almost any glue you fancy: it wouldn’t have yo be very strong.

You could have just a few such timbers, to ensure that you are maintaining gauge, and again use most glues.

 

Or go for glue all the way through.

 

You could use superglue, but the issue here is how strong the bond might be: too weak, and it is useless, too strong and you can’t adjust it.

It might be worth trying out UHU or Bostick clear and Evostick impact. I would suggest using the former pair “wet”, allowing for readjustment, and put a little weight on the rail for the pressure to help strengthen the bond. Not sure about Evostick: probably use it the same way. In both cases just a small dab of adhesive.

I would recommend considering 24 hour epoxy: you will have up to an hour to adjust the position, and then place a book on top of it overnight. You could use one-hour epoxy, but it will go off very quickly, and you won’t get much time to work.

 

Even more than when using solvent, you will need to pre-curve your rails pretty accurately, to help reduce stress on the joints.

 

Two key (sorry about the pun!) points (sorry, another one):

Each glue joint does not have to very strong, as it is the combined impact of lots of small joints which gives it the strength;

I have found it possible, when using solvent to join plastic chairs to wooden sleepers and timbers, to break the joint by carefully sliding in a single edge razor blade.i see no reason why this should not still be the case, although it will be less easy to put some more glue in between the base of the chair and the wood, then re-flooding with solvent. So, repairs are not impossible, and a few chairs unglued will not be the end of the world (or at least, the layout).

 

Best thing is for you to lay a few sleepers, times how many glues you have available, and try glueing the chairs down with a short length of rail. 4-5 sleepers should be enough, but lay both rails (can be different glue on each side) and put a small book on it.

 

Let us know how you get on.