46256 Posted January 14, 2016 Share Posted January 14, 2016 (edited) DJH Big Bertha kit delivered together with wheelset. Will post photos of its construction hopefully to assist any others wishing to construct this or other whitemetal kits Edited August 7, 2023 by 46256 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Downendian Posted January 14, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 14, 2016 I'll be watching this thread. I've always been interested in this big beast - not that I'll add it to the to do list which is far too long anyway. Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted January 14, 2016 Share Posted January 14, 2016 It's right up there with the Beyer-Garratt in my very short list of non-preserved engines that I'd like to have a go at one day. Had the 0-10-0 or the B-G survived into preservation, would they have been of much use on the heritage lines, given their size and not inconsiderable weight? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earlswood Nob Posted January 14, 2016 Share Posted January 14, 2016 G'day all I'd love to reproduce the incident on the Lickey Incline, when a freight hauled by a LMS Garratt and banked by the LNER Garratt stalled and had to be helped out by Big Bertha. If my maths is correct that totaled 38 driving wheels. Earlswood nob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted January 14, 2016 Share Posted January 14, 2016 ....reproduce the incident on the Lickey Incline.... I wonder if anyone has tried replicating a 1-in-37 incline. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
malcolmy Posted January 14, 2016 Share Posted January 14, 2016 I've always been fascinated by the Lickey Incline, and especially all the various banking loco combinations. I remember being taken there by my uncle (at least 40 years ago), and having an express flatten shiney new pennies we'd put on the track. Hopefully now that someone's started a kit build, there will be an RTR announcement! lol 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted January 14, 2016 Author Share Posted January 14, 2016 Not intentionally in respect of the 1 in 37 Ivan......just spent Xmas relaying the tightest curve into my fiddle yard.....shades of network rail....the test will be if and when this beast negotiates it !....Bachmann 9f does so with ease, so there is hope. I will if I may go through the stages as if to assist someone who has never built one of these kits. Apologies to those with more experience if it becomes a case of teaching granny to suck eggs... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeeleyBridge Posted January 14, 2016 Share Posted January 14, 2016 There was an N gauge layout in the 1970s that portrayed the line, it was featured in the Railway Modeller. Diseasels though (25s?). Looking forward to seeing this build. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pointstaken Posted January 14, 2016 Share Posted January 14, 2016 I will if I may go through the stages as if to assist someone who has never built one of these kits. Apologies to those with more experience if it becomes a case of teaching granny to suck eggs... There may well be viewers on here who don't actually post but who are building "Big Bertha". Also adding to the stock of knowledge is also a useful attribute. NEVER assume that your efforts are wasted. Dennis Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted January 14, 2016 Author Share Posted January 14, 2016 A recent example was a modeller I believe called Bob Bang who replicated Bromsgrove, part indoors and part outside layout. It appeared in BRM, cant recall if bertha was modelled. The prompt for me was an idle look at DJH website and saw it is to be discontinued. I had planned to purchase at some stage but this has moved it up the agenda. I could of course have been panicked into purchase... Ive read in another thread that cylinders were preserved....is this true? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted January 14, 2016 Share Posted January 14, 2016 .....Ive read in another thread that cylinders were preserved....is this true? No. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted January 14, 2016 Author Share Posted January 14, 2016 Thanks I thought it was one of those "legends" bit like the strategic reserve... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted January 14, 2016 Share Posted January 14, 2016 Thanks I thought it was one of those "legends" bit like the strategic reserve... There are cylinder exhibits from scrapped or dismantled engines, but most of those I've seen are in Germany. There is also a massive prototype cylinder block at Mulhouse which was apparently used by Chapelon and his team as a test piece for the building of the long-lost SNCF 160A1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Harvey Posted January 14, 2016 Share Posted January 14, 2016 It's a nice kit to build and when built it will go around set track point work mine dose. The hardest part is doing the tender roof properly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted January 14, 2016 Author Share Posted January 14, 2016 the contents of the djh kit placed on kitchen work surface....no it won't be built there much to my wifes relief. I have constructed a number of DJH products and this is certainly a quality item. The cost so far however has been in excess of £220, and still motor and gearbox to source. I realised yesterday on receipt of this,that it has been a while, since I've constructed....more precisely soldered a whitemetal kit. I have soldered umpteen brass and nickel silver items mainly chassis in recent times. I know from painful ecpxperience that whitemetal has different qualities near the tip of a hot soldering iron. I will be using my preferred iron an antex 25 w...carrs flux and low melt solder. Small details and where appropriate other items will be affixed with various adhesives. Higher temp solder will be used on the brass chassis on such as bearings etc. One concern that should not materialise is that of weight. Have made many chassis and married them to light weight plastic / NS/ brass bodies only to have to resort to liquid lead superglued in place to add the necessary weight to assist traction. This is a fine art especially with 460 s ,too much in certain areas can cause unsteadiness / derailments. Too little and your beautiful creation is a mere ornament. One last disclaimer for now my methods have been gleaned from the numerous articles / books and assorted writings not least from the gent who penned the forward in the kit a certain Mr Wright. If this model succeeds it will in no small measure be because of them, If it does not, the fault will be mine alone.......and my tools ..........and that soldering iron ....and.... 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted January 14, 2016 Author Share Posted January 14, 2016 It's a nice kit to build and when built it will go around set track point work mine dose. The hardest part is doing the tender roof properly. thanks Pete, yes I've noticed from the instructions the need to reduce the tender sides for LMS/ BR, and then affix the tender cab....looking forward to it. I may commence with tende construction, have found in the past have forged ahead with the sexy bit the loco body and chassis then found the tender construction to be ....tedious...thereby not always ensuring the care necessary... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Alder Posted January 14, 2016 Share Posted January 14, 2016 100 degree solder - available from C&L -is far easier to work with than the 70 version as it flows - makes white metal building a far more enjoyable job. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londontram Posted January 14, 2016 Share Posted January 14, 2016 (edited) I shall be following this build with interest as I've had a near on 35 year love affair with Big Bertha. I'm sure I've told this on here before somewhere but back in the day my first really big layout was a large working midland roundhouse and living near Derby I was midland mad. Gee Dee models in Nottingham as well as its new sales had a cabinet full of second hand and kit built locos one of which was a scratch built model of Big Bertha built from two Airfix 4F bodies mounted on a 9F chassis with one of the 4F providing the tender drive. I know by today's standards it was a real mish mash but this was 1980 and we were all a bit more tolerant about fine scale then even to the fact it still had the 9F single slide bar motion but who ever built it had done a very good job and it was one of those if it looked right it was right models and I lusted after it for months and even to this day regret not getting it. So I very much look forward to your build. Regards Steve Edited January 15, 2016 by Londontram Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted January 15, 2016 Author Share Posted January 15, 2016 Steve yes I've seen versions of this model constructed from various donors.....like yourself I derive a great deal of satisfaction in ....hopefully transforming humble plastic bits and pieces into recognisable models of rarer types. I have commented on your thread , my admiration how you have taken some unexpected items and created things like domes . I hope I will not have to be as creative with this...DJH having done that for me...we will see. Apologies to any one browsing for not having made a start.....work the curse of the modelling class. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted January 15, 2016 Author Share Posted January 15, 2016 My good friend John (RowanJ) sent me a pm yesterday stating he had initially been unable to find this thread.....he had been looking for " Brian does big Bertha"....I did suggest his search on that title, might broaden his modelling interests!....enough of that will be commencing the tender alterations this weekend...even if it is freezing up in my loft......my wife may yet have to agree to the Derby assembly line relocating temporarily to the kitchen 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted January 15, 2016 Author Share Posted January 15, 2016 ok have removed various pieces of tender construct from plastic packaging. I want to examine the instruction to reduce the tender sides by 5 mm for the BR version. I have read the advice many times get as many photographs as possible of your intended model. I can only sgree whole heartedly. A number of things are becoming apparent and are not intended as criticism of this product, merely my observation. Firstly if you remove 5mm straight across as shown then you will not marry the side of the tender cowl. I have instead allowed a flare which will continue the line of the tender side into the cowl...as shown by the pencil line. The photo of Bertha is from on midland lines by huntriss and she is at Derby works 1951. It is in this condition I want my model to represent .it also shows the BR adapted tender did indeed have shallower tender sides.it will also mean that the top f the tender beading will need adding after removal. Lastly for now the rat pice of the tender cowl, that which face the coal space another phot clearly shows the small round Windows had protective bars not modelled by DJH...more soon, for now collecting more photos...luckily a week photographed loco Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted January 15, 2016 Author Share Posted January 15, 2016 Sorry rat piece indeed...rear piece of the tender cowl.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted January 15, 2016 Author Share Posted January 15, 2016 It's a nice kit to build and when built it will go around set track point work mine dose. The hardest part is doing the tender roof properly. pete as per my pm sincere thank you for the drawings, they do indeed confirm the need to reduce the tender sides and still allow them to marry up, and indeed " flow" into the tender cowl..really appreciated, may I ask you post them here for general info...best wishes brian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
N15class Posted January 15, 2016 Share Posted January 15, 2016 How does this one from DJH come as far as being dimensionally correct? It is one of those odd looking locos that oozes character. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
46256 Posted January 15, 2016 Author Share Posted January 15, 2016 (edited) N15...i am forming the impression that this was an early example of djh kits....ok onLy forming these opinions so far ,from my examining the tender. I have built later djh kits...std Caprotti class 5 and thompson A2/3 in last ten years..... From evidence such as instructions...level of detail and alternative parts....plus use of different materials, such as whitemetal and etched brass combined, well you can see the evolution of these kits. In respect of Bertha, she is fully whitemetal and if you wish to model the tender as built circa 1919, then she appears accurate. In my case it appears from a number of photographs that by 1949....and the 1951state I want to model the tender had been reduced. I would expect if this kit was being designed now that you would be provided with the options rather than having to adapt a casting. I note also another early design item fixing the trnder wheel sets into the tender sides rather than creating a chassis sub assembly as per later kits. I state this only to provide an honest opinion, am I happy overall with this kit yes...am I confident.that a model of Bertha can be produced from it that will have the impact of the real thing, definitely. Am I capable of doing so....the £200 plus question Edited August 7, 2022 by 46256 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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