Locos for Tyneside in the BR era. Kerr Stuart Victory.

[rowanj]

Dont quite know what happened to the photo of the crosshead - it was OK on the phone..but wasnt very interesting anyway so I've deleted it.

 

Anyway, 1 side down, 1 to go. The black is Railmatch Weathered Black ,  - though I think it will need another light spray .The crossheads are my filed and polished Comet ones. I was finding  an occasional tight spot so filed down the rod to use the tube supplied with the kit., which keeps the rod parallel to the cylinder bars. This seems to be necessary with the sloping cylinders, and I'm glad I followed advice and used the tube.

 

I'm not sure about the discs on the front of the cylinders. They are fitted just as described in the instructions, but look more prominent than on photos. Need to think about that. ( Edit - I've now pared them back and think they look much more realistic. I'll be fitting the NER draincocks, which aren't included in the kit)

 

The coal in the tender is just a carved piece of plastic from a GBL tender, and is there to give a bit of shape before real coal is added.

 

John

Edited October 10, 2017 by rowanj

[46256]

Double slidebars John us LMS types swear by them.....well we did until our man Riddles used singles on most of the standards...or was it swear at them ? No matter always a pleasure to see your models and PMs best wishes Brian

[rowanj]

I've had a go at putting something between the frames, which otherwise look very bare. Of course, once the loco body is fitted, you can't see them, but I'll know they are there. I sound a decent video on YouTube taken at Darlington Head of Steam, which showed the "boxes" - are they balance weights - and the support bars. At least it looks less "nude"

 

John

 

 

[rowanj]

Going away for a week, but the next significant task will be to fit the lubrication rods to the second driving wheel. Can anyone who has done that advise on the quartering, IE at what degree should the soldered arm on the driver point with the coupling rods at ,6 o clock?

Edited October 14, 2017 by rowanj

[rowanj]

Progress so far. The chassis works under power, and the wheels have the first coat of paint. Missing from the kit are the NER-style draincocks and the sandboxes , both of which are prominent on photos, so I had a go at both. I'll pick out the draincocks when I get to weathering. Other than pickups, all that's left is to fit a dummy front coupling and glazing, plus coal for the tender. I also fitted the small steps on the smokebox door. I seem to have lost the lampiron from the smokebox top, so will see how easy it is to replace it without damaging the handrail. which was fitted as 2 pieces with a soldered join at the handrail knob - much easier, I find, than trying to fit it as a single piece.

 

This particular loco was shopped at Darlington in May 1957 when it got the later tender crest.

[mikemeg]

An observation (though not a criticism) is that there is a disparity in running plate height between the loco and tender. The North Eastern (and the LNER) went to great lengths to ensure that the loco and tender rode at the same height.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

Edited October 25, 2017 by mikemeg

[rowanj]

An observation (though not a criticism) is that there is a disparity in running plate height between the loco and tender. The North Eastern (and the LNER) went to great lengths to ensure that the loco and tender rode at the same height.

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

You are quite correct, Mike. When I bolted the footplate to the chassis, after reading your post - its just loose on the photo - it pulls it down a touch and looks a bit better. I also used 16mm tender wheels, This probably accounts for the discrepancy. I cant see an easy way to do anything else to level things up without building a slope into the footplate, so I'll just have to overload the coal and pretend the tender springs are due replacement..

[mikemeg]

You are quite correct, Mike. When I bolted the footplate to the chassis, after reading your post - its just loose on the photo - it pulls it down a touch and looks a bit better. I also used 16mm tender wheels, This probably accounts for the discrepancy. I cant see an easy way to do anything else to level things up without building a slope into the footplate, so I'll just have to overload the coal and pretend the tender springs are due replacement..

 

Is there a sub frame (carrying the wheels) on the tender and, if present, is it removable? If so then a packing piece between the sub frame and the underside of the tender would raise the tender superstructure and equalise (or at least reduce the discrepancy) in ride height.

 

Regards

 

Mike

Edited October 25, 2017 by mikemeg

[rowanj]

Attached are a batch of pictures of the virtually completed Q7, with genuine Barrow Hill coal in the tender. All I'll add now will be cab glazing and crew. I have done some very light dry-brush weathering, but didn't want to ruin the "worn black" effect which the Railmatch paint gives. Also, I wanted to model the loco just a few months out of works. Finally, I'm a lousy painter.

 

Following Mike's tip, I've got a better, though still not perfect alignment between loco and tender. I also refitted the rear steps under the cab, which I'd fitted too close to the edge. I think the effect looks more realistic.

 

I'll post a final photo in situ on the layout, then move on to the SEF N5.

 

John

[mikemeg]

Can I make a couple more observations? On some of your photographs, the tender is partially derailed, which does then distort the 'ride line' of the tender running plate.

 

On the third photo, in the above sequence, the chimney appears to be a little askew.

 

Regards

 

Mike

Edited October 27, 2017 by mikemeg

[rowanj]

Can I make a couple more observations? On some of your photographs, the tender is partially derailed, which does then distort the 'ride line' of the tender running plate.

 

On the third photo, in the above sequence, the chimney appears to be a little askew.

 

Regards

 

Mike

I've never been completely happy with the casting of the chimney, Mike. At the moment it's just super glued until I can source a brass casting ..I think PDK now supply them as spares, but as Santa is bringing me a B16/2, I'll wait and see what's in the kit.

 

The derailment is just my bloody carelessness.

 

John

Edited October 27, 2017 by rowanj

[rowanj]

Just for info, this is what you get wit the LRM J25 kit. It always looks a bit daunting when you see it like this......

[Blandford1969]

Just for info, this is what you get wit the LRM J25 kit. It always looks a bit daunting when you see it like this......

I've always loved that moment when you finally see and etch (especially when I've designed it for myself) but I know what you mean

[46256]

Keep you out of mischief John...fingerprints who needs them....the joy of soldering brass. Looking forward to seeing this come together best wishes Brian

[rowanj]

As I'm waiting for wheels for the J25, I dug out the box for the SEF N5, I "won" the kit almost 2 years ago on EBay, but had almost decided not to bother with it as I now want to concentrate on locos appropriate to my in progress layout based just north of Heaton. The link for that is below. So the plan was to re-sell the N5.

 

However Booklaw Vol 13, Steam Memories on Shed, has a photo on p.54 of 69297 at Sunderland. The caption indicates that in 1957-58, it and 69290 were transferred from Wrexham, and spent time at Tyne Dock before moving to Sunderland and thence to New England. How much work they did is a good question, but it's an excuse to keep and build the kit.

 

The kit seems a good starting point for new modellers. I wasn't going to bother posting anything as I was sure there already was a build on BRM, but I now cant find it. The N5 isn't a class I'm familiar with, so any tips, especially of the locos in question. One issue with the kit I have come across is that the loco tanks and cab were prominently riveted, whilst the whitemetal sides are rivet - free. I understand SEF supply etched overlays, so I'll need to investigate that.

 

The etched chassis is a nice piece of work. The photos show it held by 2 screwed spacers, with the etched spacers just laid in place, These were a lovely fit. The chassis is, correctly designed with the trailing axle running through the chassis, rather than on a trailing bogie. So you have a sort of quasi 0-8-0, which may cause issues on tighter radii, dodgy trackwork or baseboards, or all 3. But I'll try to build it a designed and only fit a bogie if I have to.

 

John

Edited November 8, 2017 by rowanj

[rowanj]

As suspected, this has been a straightforward chassis so far. It revolves without problem on my curves without having to recourse to fitting a trailing bogie, and just out of curiosity, I tried it on 3rd radius Hornby curves and it worked on them too. The chassis design gives plenty of sideplay on the driving wheels.

 

I used 20mm Romfords and 14,mm trailing bogie wheels (Hornby).They slightly lifted the rear drivers, and so that took a bit of fiddling. I have some prototype Gibson bogie wheels, and will see if I can use these, just for the look. As suggested by Tony W, I removed the front half of each driving wheel spring on the "live" side to aid fitting pickups.

 

John.

[Michael Edge]

It won't work very well with just sideplay on the trailing axle - it does need to be radial movement. I usually cut the frames behind the cab steps and turn it into a pony truck but our next GC loco (C14) is being designed with an internal pony truck to mimic the radius of the radial axleboxes. I've tried building proper radial axleboxes (found in Finney kits) but there's usually too much friction in 4mm scale for them to work reliably enough.

[micklner]

I would imagine the Hornby rear trailing wheel is oversize , Gibson will be much better and the correct size.

[rowanj]

It won't work very well with just sideplay on the trailing axle - it does need to be radial movement. I usually cut the frames behind the cab steps and turn it into a pony truck but our next GC loco (C14) is being designed with an internal pony truck to mimic the radius of the radial axleboxes. I've tried building proper radial axleboxes (found in Finney kits) but there's usually too much friction in 4mm scale for them to work reliably enough.

 

Well, that's put the cat amongst the pigeons, but when a modeller like Mike makes an observation, it behoves the rest of us to listen. I confess I was always a little uncertain about having a fixed rear axle.

 

Am I right in thinking you are suggesting that I use the pieces of the chassis to fabricate a pony truck. I don't suppose you have a photo of what you did?

 

Thanks for the advice.

 

Mick - the Hornby wheel is 14mm which is what SEF suggest, I don't think its too big, but the chassis design does mean that it must not interfere with the coupled wheels by lifting the rear.

[micklner]

    Have you measured the actual wheel, Hornby are'nt always the exact size, quite often they are slightly oversize and have deeper flanges too . They are designed for their range and I wouldn't use them on a scale model personally.  

    I have just done a ex NER N10 and that came with option of cutting the rear of the frames off and using a pony truck , it was supplied on the etch. LRM do a etch of the trailing/radial  truck, its on their LNWR list page, but it should be near enough for your needs.

[Michael Edge]

Well, that's put the cat amongst the pigeons, but when a modeller like Mike makes an observation, it behoves the rest of us to listen. I confess I was always a little uncertain about having a fixed rear axle.

 

Am I right in thinking you are suggesting that I use the pieces of the chassis to fabricate a pony truck. I don't suppose you have a photo of what you did?

 

Thanks for the advice.

 

Mick - the Hornby wheel is 14mm which is what SEF suggest, I don't think its too big, but the chassis design does mean that it must not interfere with the coupled wheels by lifting the rear.

 

14mm is the correct diameter - 3'6".

Basically I use two overlapping frame spacers in the cab step area, when all the frames are complete I cut through the frames behind the steps where it isn't noticeable. The pivot point is too close to the trailing axle for accurate geometry though, which is why I am now working with internal pony trucks and drive on a different axle.

You can't really see the gap in the frames from most angles.

View from below, the painted 10BA screw is the pivot for the pony truck - should really be a lot longer but the driven axle prevents this. The shiny brass screw is the one holding the frames in the body, this one is in a slot allowing the truck to pivot. This screw is slightly loose to allow movement, the axle is in slots with light p/b spring wires to allow up and down movement.

Section of the drawing of our N5 etch, the blue lines are the outline of the two frame spacers, black and red lines show where the screws go through.

Our N5 etch has this arrangement built in.

[grob1234]

Very clever, Micheal. I like it.

[Baldyoldgit]

I used a piece of piano wire, and a couple of pieces of tube. There is a joggle in the frames for the rear axle. The linkage to brakes stops it moving too far. Now i need to clean the wheels, remove that bit of fluff and get a better camera.

 

Tony.

[rowanj]

Mike/Tony. Thanks very much for your help and very informative posts and photos.

 

John

[Michael Edge]

It's the radial movement which is really important, it's usually a good idea to follow what was done in full size, the dynamics of wheels on rails are the same in any scale. Below is the arrangement for the C14 with an internal pony truck to mimic the radial axleboxes. The frames on this loco were set in quite a lot to allow radial movement and I hope this will be enough for most models, however this is being produced initially for S7 - 4mm will follow later.

This time the drive will be on the leading axle, the two coupled axles are compensated, the bogie will be centrally sprung and compensated.