Driving standards

[Michael Hodgson]

14 hours ago, PhilJ W said:

Another idiot.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-norfolk-55180594

NFN

[johnofwessex]

Again though, in both cases why didnt they get the same treatment as a firearms offender?

 

And/Or of course both of them have passed a driving test, they have demonstrated an ability to drive to the standard required but chosen not to do so.  

 

Why dont we have a version of what is done in the state of Victoria Australia & make them prove that they now understand how they must behave when driving before they get their licences back.

[PhilJ W]

[peanuts]

On 29/05/2021 at 21:08, johnofwessex said:

Again though, in both cases why didnt they get the same treatment as a firearms offender?

 

And/Or of course both of them have passed a driving test, they have demonstrated an ability to drive to the standard required but chosen not to do so.  

 

Why dont we have a version of what is done in the state of Victoria Australia & make them prove that they now understand how they must behave when driving before they get their licences back.

Iirc in both cases they will have to go on courses and take an exstended re test before they are given they're licence back .in the case of the HGV driver he will have to convince the local traffic comissioner before any of his vocational licences are returned and will probarly have to re sit tests for those if he can afford them and find an employer who can insure him in a hgv 

[petethemole]

6 hours ago, peanuts said:

Iirc in both cases they will have to go on courses and take an exstended re test before they are given they're licence back .in the case of the HGV driver he will have to convince the local traffic comissioner before any of his vocational licences are returned and will probarly have to re sit tests for those if he can afford them and find an employer who can insure him in a hgv 

I think it was on an episode of Traffic Cops a few years ago when the police stopped an HGV driver who was drinking Stella while driving and had a bag full of cans in the cab.  Being processed in the police car he admitted to being an alcoholic and was aked his occupation, "Well I used to be a lorry driver".

[Reorte]

On 29/05/2021 at 21:08, johnofwessex said:

Why dont we have a version of what is done in the state of Victoria Australia & make them prove that they now understand how they must behave when driving before they get their licences back.

I find it hard to believe that anyone doesn't know they shouldn't drink and drive (I suppose there are the "only had a couple so I should be OK" cases). Telling people how they should behave doesn't help if they already know it but don't care.

[admiles]

11 hours ago, peanuts said:

Iirc in both cases they will have to go on courses and take an exstended re test before they are given they're licence back .in the case of the HGV driver he will have to convince the local traffic comissioner before any of his vocational licences are returned and will probarly have to re sit tests for those if he can afford them and find an employer who can insure him in a hgv 

 

The HGV was left hand drive so at a guess I suspect there won't be any local traffic commissioners involved.

Edited June 3, 2021 by admiles

[kevinlms]

This guy won't be driving any time soon. Under Australian laws 12 Demerit points is an immediate suspension, so 50 points, is at least 4 years worth.

 

https://www.caradvice.com.au/961942/subaru-brz-driver-clocks-up-equivalent-of-10000-in-fines-after-being-chased-by-police-helicopter/?utm_source=Nine-Front-Page&utm_medium=Referral

[kevinlms]

One idiot from Australia, who only got fined $393 for that!

 

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-06-21/act-greens-want-tougher-penalties-for-drivers-who-hit-cyclists/100230742

[johnofwessex]

I drove to Oxford yesterday via the A303 & A34.

 

Highlights included an unmarked lorry who seemed to think that changing lanes when his tail was less than a cars length away from me was a good idea.

 

Given that The Police are increasingly using dashcam footage for prosecutions what about a Govrnment website where you can upload dashcam footage, the requirement must be that you have to include the vehicles Registration number.

 

It could then 

 

1. Be viewed by Insurers who could look at their customers

2. Employers would be required to log the reg no's of their vehicles & any vehicle they paid expenses for on the site.  If any footage of their vehicles was uploaded they would be notified and required to view it and report what action they take over it.  A sample of the reports would then be reviewed.

3. Police and Traffic Commissioners could view it.

 

[F-UnitMad]

41 minutes ago, johnofwessex said:

Given that The Police are increasingly using dashcam footage for prosecutions what about a Govrnment website where you can upload dashcam footage,

West Midlands Police have their own email address where you can send stuff like that, and footage from smart doorbells, phones etc.

Try the Constabulary website responsible for the area where it happened. They might be interested in an unmarked truck anyway, for AFAIK all large commercial vehicles are required to carry a Company name or logo at the very least, by law.

[peanuts]

19 minutes ago, F-UnitMad said:

West Midlands Police have their own email address where you can send stuff like that, and footage from smart doorbells, phones etc.

Try the Constabulary website responsible for the area where it happened. They might be interested in an unmarked truck anyway, for AFAIK all large commercial vehicles are required to carry a Company name or logo at the very least, by law.

since when ? think you are confusing things with busses and coaches having to display operators adress know plenty of companys operate plain white lorrys and trailers .

[PhilJ W]

40 minutes ago, F-UnitMad said:

West Midlands Police have their own email address where you can send stuff like that, and footage from smart doorbells, phones etc.

Try the Constabulary website responsible for the area where it happened. They might be interested in an unmarked truck anyway, for AFAIK all large commercial vehicles are required to carry a Company name or logo at the very least, by law.

 

19 minutes ago, peanuts said:

since when ? think you are confusing things with busses and coaches having to display operators adress know plenty of companys operate plain white lorrys and trailers .

All commercial vehicles over a certain weight have to carry the operator/owners name and address. Problem is that it is only required to be placed behind the N/S front wheel and in not very large letters.

[Titan]

1 hour ago, johnofwessex said:

Given that The Police are increasingly using dashcam footage for prosecutions what about a Govrnment website where you can upload dashcam footage, the requirement must be that you have to include the vehicles Registration number.

 

 

There is:

https://www.nextbase.com/en-gb/national-dash-cam-safety-portal/

 

OK it is not a government website, but the Police have successfully prosecuted solely on footage uploaded to the site.  Unfortunately it is yet to cover all areas.

 

Edit - it actually looks a lot more comprehensive compared to when I checked it out some time ago!

 

Edited June 21, 2021 by Titan

[ejstubbs]

Scotland - which these days has a single police force for the whole country - still noticeably absent from that map.

 

I have heard that there is some issue in Scottish law with using video evidence.  On the other hand I believe Police Scotland has recently been encouraging cyclists to include video evidence when reporting dangerous close passes.  Wish they'd make their minds up one way or t'other.

[F-UnitMad]

2 hours ago, peanuts said:

since when ? think you are confusing things with busses and coaches having to display operators adress know plenty of companys operate plain white lorrys and trailers .

Trailers are another matter anyway; in the UK they don't have a seperate registration number for one thing. Cabs might have it in small letters on the back, hidden away a bit. A lot of trucks are leased and white is a factory standard colour; company graphics are applied on vinyl film, even complex ones like Stobart's. It's easily removable when the truck goes off-lease and enters the second-hand market.

[johnofwessex]

What would be interesting though is getting insurers to view the data and requiring employers to look at it and take action.

[Kris]

12 minutes ago, johnofwessex said:

What would be interesting though is getting insurers to view the data and requiring employers to look at it and take action.

Doing this would massively increase the cost of insurance. The insurance companies would require thousands of extra staff to view the footage. You also have the issue of customers being unhappy with what could be consider to be arbitrary decisions. 

Often there is much more to a snap shot incident that is seen in dash camera footage than initially meets the eye. When I reported an incident to the police (red light jumping nearly hitting a pedestrian) I was asked to provide footage from 3 minutes before the incident to 3 minutes after it. This was to demonstrate that there was no previous incident that could be linked. 

[johnofwessex]

I am not suggesting that Insurers should be required to view it, just that they could be able to.

 

If you got an application for insurance on a particular vehicle that had a lot of 'hits' on the site then they might want a look 

[Coldgunner]

On 28/05/2021 at 20:25, PhilJ W said:

Drunken lorry driver.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-cambridgeshire-57116195

I know that area well and considering how undulating the A1 can be heading past/north of Peterborough its a miracle no one was killed. Its a ropey section of road at the best of times.

[johnofwessex]

What I dont understand is firstly why no on the spot ban for drink driving and secondly why domt we do what they do in Victoria, Australia and no automatic return of your licence after a ban, you have instead to demonstrate that you understand why you were banned and wont do it again.  In the case of drink drivers that means alcohol locks. 

[ianwales]

The problem with dash cam, helmet cam and every other sort of cam footage it is turning people into judge, jury and executioner, sometimes when I've been cycling  another cyclist will pass an opinion that a driver was close passing us while to me it wasn't close at all.

[ejstubbs]

6 hours ago, ianwales said:

The problem with dash cam, helmet cam and every other sort of cam footage it is turning people into judge, jury and executioner

 

Don't be daft.  It's called "evidence".  Whether an offence has been committed and, if so, what the penalty should be are still decided by legal process, with all relevant and available sources of information about the event - including statements from witnesses and the accused - taken in to account.  Even traffic light and speed camera evidence can be challenged in court.

[ianwales]

3 hours ago, ejstubbs said:

 

Don't be daft.  It's called "evidence".  Whether an offence has been committed and, if so, what the penalty should be are still decided by legal process, with all relevant and available sources of information about the event - including statements from witnesses and the accused - taken in to account.  Even traffic light and speed camera evidence can be challenged in court.

 

Not being "daft"

 

On 22/06/2021 at 07:57, Kris said:

When I reported an incident to the police (red light jumping nearly hitting a pedestrian)

 

In the above quote, how close was the driver when the light turned Red, would hard braking potentially have caused an accident, what is "Nearly" hitting a pedestrian? it is often just someone's opinion whether something was close or "nearly", reporting it to police is just being petty and spiteful in my opinion, others are going to disagree, but, sometimes we need to look at ourselves and what we do before condemning others.

[raymw]

with the very wide angle lens on most dash cams, it is very difficult to determine actual distances. For stuff happening up close, it looks further away on the cam video.