Driving standards

[chris p bacon]

21 hours ago, Titan said:

I expect it was an automatic, and the old lady was confused and pushing  the wrong pedal.  It is stories like these that mean my mum in her 70's refuses point blank to get an automatic.

 

It doesn't matter if it's an auto or a manual, the driver selected reverse and pressed the acelerator.  it's likely in this case that the driver may have reached the end of their driving life.

 To select reverse in an auto you have to depress the brake pedal, and in a manual the clutch, both gearboxes then require a conscious decision on gear selection.

[boxbrownie]

1 hour ago, chris p bacon said:

 

It doesn't matter if it's an auto or a manual, the driver selected reverse and pressed the acelerator.  it's likely in this case that the driver may have reached the end of their driving life.

 To select reverse in an auto you have to depress the brake pedal, and in a manual the clutch, both gearboxes then require a conscious decision on gear selection.

Very true but.......this usually happens when the driver “panics” and presses the accel pedal instead of the brake thinking they are braking, in an auto when you brake the left foot does nothing, in a manual the left foot will automatically press the clutch pedal as well (usual reaction under braking at manoeuvring speed) and the drive will be disengaged and just the engine will race rather than the vehicle running on.

 

This is why this type of accident predominantly happens with autos.

[rockershovel]

9 hours ago, PatB said:

In 1965 a substantial percentage (probably the majority) of the UK vehicle fleet simply wasn't capable of sustained 70 mph cruising on a regular basis. Yes, by that time most new cars, even basic ones, could reach 70 mph, but a lot wouldn't thank you for holding them that close to their maximum for any length of time, and even more would batter their occupants into submission by noise, vibration and general unpleasantness and perceived mechanical stress after a few minutes. Even relatively high performance vehicles, such as many of the motorcycles of the day would complain if held at steady high speeds, even if the same designs could be ridden hard on the average A-road at varying throttle settings without problems. 

 

Indeed, as late as 1987, I rented a newish basic Fiesta. 950 engine and 4-speed box. Whilst enjoyably thrash able, it wasn't nice at 70. As it wasn't mine and as I was young and of limited mechanical sympathy I put up with it for the weekend. However, had it been my engine I'd have likely kept it to 60 for anything but short bursts. 

 

Yet more recently, a rental Polo managed to drink a remarkable quantity of its own oil when cruised at the UK legal limits for a month, and only felt vaguely tolerable thanks to a tonne or so of sound insulation and lots of rubber mounting. So I'd contend that, even now, sustained 70 mph cruising is a bit ambitious for some vehicles. 

 

This was clearly demonstrated when Triumph and BSA started exporting to America, in the post-WW2 era. Bikes which were well adapted to to the winding A roads and lesser roads of Britain, or the challenging topography of the Isle of Man, soon failed under the stresses of American-style flat track racing and long, open roads. 

 

When I owned a 600cc, R60/6 BMW in the mid-1970s, a bike with an all-out maximum speed of about 90mph, it was considered quite a fast bike. This was mostly because its ability to sustain cruising speeds of 75-80mph meant that it was well suited to setting fast journey times on the rapidly-increasing motorway and main trunk road network. I once achieved 69 miles in 68 minutes from Grantham to Cambridge, straight down the A1 and turn left at Alconbury; I outpaced a friend on a Honda 750 Four, because the Japanese machine could not sustain 80mph cruising on the road construction standards of the time, although the engine was easily capable of it. 

 

[boxbrownie]

18 hours ago, PhilJ W said:

 

I seem to recall that a blanket 55 mph limit was imposed during one of the fuel crisises. As has been said above there are environmental advantages in reducing speeds even for private cars.

Pretty sure it was 50 mph in the U.K. (55 mph USA) during the oil crisis, ration books were issued but not actually used (I had one and it didn’t stop me selling the tickets to my mate  he was an idiot).

I seem to remember big queues at the local petrol station but having a ration book gave me access to the “reserved” pump.

[ianwales]

16 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Those roads on which HGVs are limited to 50 mph - e.g. single carriageway A roads, could often benefit from a general 50 mph restriction anyway.

 

Oh please No! its hard enough to find a decent road that you can open up a car on as it is without adding even more restrictions and opportunities for cash grabbing camera vans!!!

[Sprintex]

16 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Those roads on which HGVs are limited to 50 mph - e.g. single carriageway A roads, could often benefit from a general 50 mph restriction anyway - many already have it.

 

The UK speed limits for HGVs over 7.5T are 40mph on single carriageway roads, 50mph on dual carriageways, and 60mph on motorways. These all increase by 10mph for thothse under 7.5T.

 

Paul

[TheQ]

1 minute ago, Sprintex said:

 

The UK speed limits for HGVs over 7.5T are 40mph on single carriageway roads, 50mph on dual carriageways, and 60mph on motorways. These all increase by 10mph for thothse under 7.5T.

 

Paul

They must have a special exemption for sugar beet Artics, they don't seem to do less that 60 on any road...

[Joseph_Pestell]

1 minute ago, TheQ said:

They must have a special exemption for sugar beet Artics, they don't seem to do less that 60 on any road...

 

Not just sugar beet. Any product where the contract drivers are on a piece rate. In Dorset it is the aggregate lorries going between the Mendip quarries and Bournemouth/Poole.

[Reorte]

5 minutes ago, Sprintex said:

 

The UK speed limits for HGVs over 7.5T are 40mph on single carriageway roads, 50mph on dual carriageways, and 60mph on motorways. These all increase by 10mph for thothse under 7.5T.

 

They were changed in 2015 to 50 mph on single carriage roads and 60 mph on dual carriageways in England and Wales (it's a devolved matter in Scotland and they haven't changed, although there's a specific exception for the A9).

[beast66606]

7 minutes ago, TheQ said:

They must have a special exemption for sugar beet Artics, they don't seem to do less that 60 on any road...

 

Or around Cantley

 

26 minutes ago, ianwales said:

 

Oh please No! its hard enough to find a decent road that you can open up a car on as it is without adding even more restrictions and opportunities for cash grabbing camera vans!!!

 

Best way to avoid those cash grabs is to stick to the speed limit, what ever it is.

Edited February 6, 2020 by beast66606

[ianwales]

17 minutes ago, beast66606 said:

 

Or around Cantley

 

 

Best way to avoid those cash grabs is to stick to the speed limit, what ever it is.

 

Hence my not wanting the speed limit lowered any more, they've even put a 50mph limit on part of the motorway here in south wales! whatever happened to David Cameron's plan to raise the motorway limit to 80mph.

Edited February 6, 2020 by ianwales

[Nick C]

28 minutes ago, ianwales said:

they've even put a 50mph limit on part of the motorway here in south wales!

 

In my experience that's usually more of an aspiration than a limit...

[TheQ]

59 minutes ago, beast66606 said:

 

Or around Cantley

 

 

 

Well, one side of Cantley, the other side they stopped delivering Beet by wherry years ago... 

[rocor]

1 hour ago, Joseph_Pestell said:

 

Not just sugar beet. Any product where the contract drivers are on a piece rate. In Dorset it is the aggregate lorries going between the Mendip quarries and Bournemouth/Poole.

 

No change there then.

 

 

[Sprintex]

6 hours ago, Reorte said:

 

They were changed in 2015 to 50 mph on single carriage roads and 60 mph on dual carriageways in England and Wales (it's a devolved matter in Scotland and they haven't changed, although there's a specific exception for the A9).

 

Ah OK, just after I got out of driving for a living (again!) 

 

Paul

[kevinlms]

One from Australia. She has now killed 3 in two incidents.

 

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02-08/family-of-2010-car-surfing-tragedy-speak-out-about-sophie-brine/11932820

[MarkC]

4 hours ago, kevinlms said:

One from Australia. She has now killed 3 in two incidents.

 

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02-08/family-of-2010-car-surfing-tragedy-speak-out-about-sophie-brine/11932820

O...M...G...

 

Awful. Simply awful.

 

Mark

[newbryford]

Lots of water about today courtesy of  Storm Ciara.

 

Three types of drivers observed during my travels to/from work.

 

1 - the vast majority -  sensible when encountering roads that were obviously deeper on one side than the other. All playing nicely and being polite when vehicles were "wrong side" and moving slowly. and giving each other plenty of time and space.

2. Eejits having very little patience through the deep water sections and approaching far too fast creating a huge water splash - guess what they were - 4x4s.

3. Folks who simply should not have ventured out today and panicked at the sight of any more than 2-3" of water and doing a U-turn. I will probably get into trouble for generalising, but old/female/Audi TT seemed to be quite common.

 

 

[MarkC]

8 hours ago, newbryford said:

Lots of water about today courtesy of  Storm Ciara.

 

Three types of drivers observed during my travels to/from work.

 

1 - the vast majority -  sensible when encountering roads that were obviously deeper on one side than the other. All playing nicely and being polite when vehicles were "wrong side" and moving slowly. and giving each other plenty of time and space.

2. Eejits having very little patience through the deep water sections and approaching far too fast creating a huge water splash - guess what they were - 4x4s.

3. Folks who simply should not have ventured out today and panicked at the sight of any more than 2-3" of water and doing a U-turn. I will probably get into trouble for generalising, but old/female/Audi TT seemed to be quite common.

 

 

In early March last year - the day of the heavy rain that shut the S & C just before a steam hauled run was due - Tornado, IIRC? - I had to drive from Knott End to York, via the A59. Conditions were horrendous, particularly around Skipton, and I definitely saw all 3 categories of driver mentioned above. I was just glad that I was in a car with both good tyres and good ground clearance (a new Peugeot 3008) - some of the standing water was pretty deep, occasionally even at the crown of the road...

 

Mark

[Jol Wilkinson]

We drove back from North London early on Sunday morning,  the weather on the M11, M25 and A12 was very windy but with very little rain. Some motorists on the lower section of the A12 in Essex were taking advantage of a following wind to go as fast as possible, while the other examples of poor, or rather inconsiderate, driving were those who think that joining a dual carriageway from a slip road gives them right of way over those on the dual carriageway. This seems to be an increasing trend and on several occasions the drivers on the main road had to brake or move over in front of other cars in the outer lane. 

 

The prize however went to the driver of a black Mercedes E class in North London who completely ignored any traffic lane rules although he stuck reasonably well to the speed limit so we had him in site for a couple of miles. Using left turn lanes at traffic lights then going straight ahead, using bus lanes, driving around the cones in into a coned off lane on a dual carriageway to get around a bus at a bus stop (which was signalling to set off), etc. 

[PhilJ W]

10 hours ago, newbryford said:

Lots of water about today courtesy of  Storm Ciara.

 

Three types of drivers observed during my travels to/from work.

 

1 - the vast majority -  sensible when encountering roads that were obviously deeper on one side than the other. All playing nicely and being polite when vehicles were "wrong side" and moving slowly. and giving each other plenty of time and space.

2. Eejits having very little patience through the deep water sections and approaching far too fast creating a huge water splash - guess what they were - 4x4s.

3. Folks who simply should not have ventured out today and panicked at the sight of any more than 2-3" of water and doing a U-turn. I will probably get into trouble for generalising, but old/female/Audi TT seemed to be quite common.

 

 

A few years ago I came across an example of #3 in Colchester. There had been a cloudburst and the roads were awash but only by a few inches. He had come to a mini roundabout and stopped causing quite a hold-up. I observed that the centre of the 'bump' on the mini roundabout was clear of the water so I just drove around him and several other cars just followed suit when they realised that the water was three inches deep at the most.

[Catkins]

On 18/12/2019 at 11:31, kevinlms said:

Isn't the real villain the truck driver who apparently had NFI?

 

On 18/12/2019 at 11:38, kevinlms said:

Does it matter, even if the car driver had made a stupid move - always a possibility, the truck driver ought to have noticed something amiss.

 

Going back to the 'Ellie Goulding' incident,
Kevin, I presume that you don't drive a heavy goods vehicle - I do, and my driving seat is about 6 foot above the road surface - despite all the mirrors that are fitted trucks still have blindspots that are big enough to lose a car in, and the Royal Mail truck will have 450HP at the crank, that is plenty powerful enough to move 44tonnes, which the Royal Mail truck would be nowhere near carrying, If the car has mis-judged pulling in front of the truck, and has been clipped by the truck, then its done for.

As for the truck driver having no idea, the driver could have been checking the mirrors on the other side of the truck to that which the car was on at the critical second!!

 

I suspect though that the car driver carried the majority of fault.

[Catkins]

On 05/02/2020 at 21:53, TheQ said:

It takes three hours to reach the A1 already and you want to slow it by a further half hour!!! 

I often drive the A17 from Lynn to Newark, and half the time I'm being slowed by car drivers who don't even do 50mph.

[Catkins]

On 06/02/2020 at 13:38, Sprintex said:

 

The UK speed limits for HGVs over 7.5T are 40mph on single carriageway roads, 50mph on dual carriageways, and 60mph on motorways. These all increase by 10mph for thothse under 7.5T.

 

Paul

Paul, I suggest that you get an up to date Highway Code.

The speed limits in ENGLAND and WALES for HGVs over 7.5 tonnes are 50mph on single carriageway roads, and 60 mph on Dual Carriageway and motorways.

The speed limits in Scotland are as you have stated, but in any and all cases they are unless signed otherwise. (there is a section of the A9 in scotland where HGVs are permitted to do 50mph on a single carriageway - but only as a 'trial')

 

If I remember correctly the DfT changed the speed limits at Easter 2013.

[TheQ]

5 hours ago, Catkins said:

I often drive the A17 from Lynn to Newark, and half the time I'm being slowed by car drivers who don't even do 50mph.

That's why I leave at stupid O'clock in the Morning...