Driving standards

[Enterprisingwestern]

 

On the subject of diversions. There are 2 ways to get to our village, so last summer the Generalitat de Valencia decided to chuck some money our way and rebuild the bridge over the reservoir to widen it and allow a cycle lane. We had a well signposted, if not somewhat tortuous, diversion in place, so on the first week of the said works the Adjutant de Alicante decided it would be a good week to resurface the diversionary route.

As an aside, the bridge works which took some 3 months for a 1 month job, typical of the country regrettably, are still not complete, although open to traffic, the cycle lane at the side of the widened bridge, (which is what the whole point of the exercise was supposedly), is fenced off and unsurfaced, although yesterday we did have 3 vans of "observers but do nothings" arrive for the umpteenth time. The clever money is on the closure and demolition of the bridge to do the job properly this time.

 

Mike.

[TheQ]

Sutton Bridge is about to be closed and or reduced to single lane working. the council as an experiment tried it... The traffic jam went back to Kings Lynn.. The alternative route  is over 20 miles extra and there is no choice, there is a river in the way.. I've got to head north in a fortnight when I come back the works will have started.....

[eastglosmog]

6 hours ago, PatB said:

No t being terribly familiar with GPS I'm mildly amused by there being a brand called Amundsen. Presumably it succeeded commercially against the competing Scott model by getting you there sooner and not abandoning you to the elements halfway home . 

Don't forget Amundsen disappeared in 1928 whilst looking for the airship Italia - so maybe not such a good name for a get you home device, after all!

[Nick C]

9 hours ago, chris p bacon said:

 

If it is a Motorhome of more than 3 tons it is restricted to 50mph on single carriageway and 60mph on dual carriageway.

As are all the van-derived ones I believe? (I.e. the ones that were built and registered as a van, and converted later)

[PhilJ W]

Just now, Nick C said:

As are all the van-derived ones I believe? (I.e. the ones that were built and registered as a van, and converted later)

This is a grey area where the law is concerned as it doesn't apply to car derived vans. Vans such as the Belingo and Ford Connect use a modified car platform but above that are entirely different. I have driven a Transit 17 seat minibus, that had a speed limiter fitted but set for a higher speed than the plain van. My sister and her husband have a coachbuilt motorhome on the same Ford Transit base weighing more than three tonnes and that does not have a limiter.

[chris p bacon]

10 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

I have driven a Transit 17 seat minibus, that had a speed limiter fitted but set for a higher speed than the plain van. My sister and her husband have a coachbuilt motorhome on the same Ford Transit base weighing more than three tonnes and that does not have a limiter.

 

Is that because the minibus is a PSV and can be for hire, whereas the motorhome isn't ?  I have a Nissan Cabstar which is rated as 3400kg (5100kg towing) and it hasn't a limiter, it just relies on the driver knowing the speed limits.......

[TheQ]

It depends whether the vehicle is registered PLG private light goods  which can run at the normal speed limits

A mini bus of 16seats or over is a PSV (ie a bus)

if you have a double wheel axle then that normally puts you into lorry categories

Some small vans that are not derived from a car, also come into the goods vehicle category and can only go at their limits.

[Nick C]

2 hours ago, PhilJ W said:

This is a grey area where the law is concerned as it doesn't apply to car derived vans. Vans such as the Belingo and Ford Connect use a modified car platform but above that are entirely different. I have driven a Transit 17 seat minibus, that had a speed limiter fitted but set for a higher speed than the plain van. My sister and her husband have a coachbuilt motorhome on the same Ford Transit base weighing more than three tonnes and that does not have a limiter.

The car-derived van bit is quite clear - The Gov.uk speed limits page has a nice table explaining all that. The bit I understand to be a grey area is those vehicles that were built and first registered as a van (and thus subject to the goods vehicle limits), and subsequently converted into a motorhome - do they then become subject to the motorhome limits, or remain subject to the goods vehicle ones?

[kevinlms]

4 minutes ago, Nick C said:

The car-derived van bit is quite clear - The Gov.uk speed limits page has a nice table explaining all that. The bit I understand to be a grey area is those vehicles that were built and first registered as a van (and thus subject to the goods vehicle limits), and subsequently converted into a motorhome - do they then become subject to the motorhome limits, or remain subject to the goods vehicle ones?

Shouldn't the company doing the conversions, supply the correct information to the owner on handover?

[Nick C]

1 hour ago, kevinlms said:

Shouldn't the company doing the conversions, supply the correct information to the owner on handover?

Most of the companies only deal in new conversions, the ones in existing vehicles tend to be more DIY. There's a specific set of rules you have to meet for the DVLA to allow you to re-register it as a motorhome, but this is the one bit of information that doesn't seem to be clear.

[Hobby]

This makes interesting reading:

 

https://www.parkers.co.uk/vans-pickups/advice/2017/van-speed-limits/

 

From what i see most "white van "drivers would seem to spend most of their time speeding then! 

[rockershovel]

8 hours ago, eastglosmog said:

Don't forget Amundsen disappeared in 1928 whilst looking for the airship Italia - so maybe not such a good name for a get you home device, after all!

 

Since you raise the subject... Scott, by his own observations, never reached the North Pole at all, misplacing it by about 10 miles. An error in calculation, common in such observations, was not detected until the figures were checked in London. 

 

Amundsen, well aware of the problem, chose to “box” an area about 20 miles square about the mathematical point. So at least one of his team probably reached the mathematical point, but which one, no one can say. On his return, lax observations resulted in them becoming entirely lost (above the glacier descent) and only recovering their route by chance - on which basis, I’d say that eponymous Satnav is well named! 

 

On the other hand, it’s probably better than having a “Peary and Cook” Satnav....

 

[eastglosmog]

5 minutes ago, rockershovel said:

 

Since you raise the subject... Scott, by his own observations, never reached the North Pole at all, misplacing it by about 10 miles. An error in calculation, common in such observations, was not detected until the figures were checked in London. 

 

Amundsen, well aware of the problem, chose to “box” an area about 20 miles square about the mathematical point. So at least one of his team probably reached the mathematical point, but which one, no one can say. On his return, lax observations resulted in them becoming entirely lost (above the glacier descent) and only recovering their route by chance - on which basis, I’d say that eponymous Satnav is well named! 

 

On the other hand, it’s probably better than having a “Peary and Cook” Satnav....

 

I thought it was the South Pole, not the North Pole, Scott claimed to have reached?

[rockershovel]

1 minute ago, eastglosmog said:

I thought it was the South Pole, not the North Pole, Scott claimed to have reached?

 

Well, shucks.. so he never got to EITHER one? Sucks to be him....

 

I must find out how to turn off the autocomplete, that or not type without my glasses..

 

[jonny777]

20 hours ago, johnofwessex said:

 

They also seem to think that they do not have to check that the road is clear before pulling out....................

 

Yes, that is rather ironic. My belief is that they see an HGV approaching and think 'I don't want to get stuck behind that'; and the net result is the HGV (and eventually about 2 miles of traffic) gets stuck behind them. 

[jonny777]

11 hours ago, TheQ said:

Sutton Bridge is about to be closed and or reduced to single lane working. the council as an experiment tried it... The traffic jam went back to Kings Lynn.. The alternative route  is over 20 miles extra and there is no choice, there is a river in the way.. I've got to head north in a fortnight when I come back the works will have started.....

 

Yes, I saw the signs. The earlier short experiment was quite useful once it had been removed, because I wondered why almost all the westbound traffic turned towards Wisbech when I was heading along the A17 last week. The main road was almost deserted for a few miles towards the A47. 

[Enterprisingwestern]

14 hours ago, TheQ said:

Sutton Bridge is about to be closed and or reduced to single lane working. the council as an experiment tried it... The traffic jam went back to Kings Lynn.. The alternative route  is over 20 miles extra and there is no choice, there is a river in the way.. I've got to head north in a fortnight when I come back the works will have started.....

 

They should build a railway line instead,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,oh, wait.

 

Mike.

[TheQ]

.

 

Yes in a couple of weeks time I shall drive along the trackbed of the M&GN at Stalham, then a couple of hours later continue along the trackbed near Sutton bridge.. The road works on the bridge were supposed to have started by now, but have been put back to September 30th. So I'll go up the A17 but come back A1, A47. meeting the traffic that is going A17 Wisbech A17 at the Elm Hall roundabout which is a nightmare at the best of times..

 

 

 

A miracle occured.. I saw a cyclist on the NDR cycle path instead of dicing with death on the dual carrigeway...

 

 

Edited September 19, 2019 by TheQ
wrong thread edited to just the driving bit

[kevinlms]

August 2019 selection from Australia - nothing like entitlement!

 

 

[jonny777]

A conundrum occurred to me while driving towards Bristol on the Portway (A4) the other day. The road is a dual carriageway but the left hand lane going away from Sea Mills is a 24 hour bus lane. If emergency vehicles were travelling as fast as the conditions would allow with lights and sirens on and approached my car from behind, would they automatically switch to the bus lane to undertake me - or do I switch to the bus lane to let them pass, and risk a fine if I am photo'd by any bus lane cameras?

 

 

[Nick C]

48 minutes ago, jonny777 said:

A conundrum occurred to me while driving towards Bristol on the Portway (A4) the other day. The road is a dual carriageway but the left hand lane going away from Sea Mills is a 24 hour bus lane. If emergency vehicles were travelling as fast as the conditions would allow with lights and sirens on and approached my car from behind, would they automatically switch to the bus lane to undertake me - or do I switch to the bus lane to let them pass, and risk a fine if I am photo'd by any bus lane cameras?

 

 

I'd stay put (in fact, pull as far right as I could) and let them use the bus lane. They're allowed to, you're not. The same with traffic lights - you're not allowed to pass a red even to let an ambulance pass, and people have been prosecuted for doing so.

 

The most important thing is to be predictable, don't suddenly do something odd in front of them - if they see you trundling along at the limit in your lane, and the bus lane free, they're going to go for the bus lane, so if you suddenly swerved across there, it makes it harder for them.

[PatB]

51 minutes ago, jonny777 said:

A conundrum occurred to me while driving towards Bristol on the Portway (A4) the other day. The road is a dual carriageway but the left hand lane going away from Sea Mills is a 24 hour bus lane. If emergency vehicles were travelling as fast as the conditions would allow with lights and sirens on and approached my car from behind, would they automatically switch to the bus lane to undertake me - or do I switch to the bus lane to let them pass, and risk a fine if I am photo'd by any bus lane cameras?

 

 

My thought would be to maintain speed and course so as not to introduce any unpredictability into the situation, and let the pros make their way around you via the bus lane. 

[duncan]

They can use the bus lane & should do so.

[jonny777]

Yes, thanks for the replies. My conundrum comes from the fact that in a situation where a very quick decision has to be made by me, the instinct I have is to get out of their way and let them drive as straight a course as possible. 

[Nick C]

4 minutes ago, PatB said:

My thought would be to maintain speed and course so as not to introduce any unpredictability into the situation, and let the pros make their way around you via the bus lane. 

Agreed.

 

A lot of people will panic on seeing blue lights behind them and either stop suddenly or do something else unpredictable. It's much better to carry on as you are while you think objectively "what's the safest thing I can do to let them pass me" - for example, a few years ago I was driving along a twisty, hilly narrow B road in Cornwall when I saw a fire appliance appear some way behind me - the road was in a fairly steep cutting with nowhere safe to pull over, so the safest thing for me to do was to continue as I was until I found a safe place to pull out of the way - and they hadn't actually caught me up by the time I got to the next junction and pulled in, so by maintaining course I didn't slow them down at all.

 

10 minutes ago, jonny777 said:

Yes, thanks for the replies. My conundrum comes from the fact that in a situation where a very quick decision has to be made by me, the instinct I have is to get out of their way and let them drive as straight a course as possible. 

 

It's even more important to think carefully with Ambulances - if they've got a patient in the back, they need to be as smooth as possible (If you've ever seen an ambulance with blue lights seemingly going quite slowly, that's why...), so the last thing they need is to have to swerve around you. In this situation they have loads of time to see you, be aware of where you are and where they expect you to go (straight on), and move gently over to the bus lane. I wouldn't be surprised if they just sat in the bus lane the whole way anyway...